Except in rare circumstances, mostly human ones, animals (including humans) don’t want to die, and die anyways.
The best we can give them is a fervent life and a humane death. The meat industry is atrocious at this, and carbon dioxide is a terrible idea - particularly when nitrogen is readily available, humane, and cheap.
Nature will undoubtedly provide a grisly and cruel death. Animals don’t have a concept of “long, well-lived life full of meaning.” They do have a direct experience of “having food and shelter and being generally free of pain is enjoyable.”
It doesn’t matter if it’s in their prime (before they decline and life becomes difficult) or of it’s after their prime - except that if you wait too long, life starts to suck pretty bad.
If you want to end predation, you’ll have an eternal task on your hands.
It was three distinct points. But it wouldn’t matter if I did reason it out for you - your stance is emotive, and you won’t agree with me unless that viewpoint underlying your stance changes, and it won’t change due to someone reasoning it out for you.
The slow grind of time, and the steady erosion by nature may cause you to change, though. Fortunately, whether it does or not, it’s basically irrelevant to me whether or not you believe or act as I do.
1 - everyone dies
2 - I assume without evidence that death is generally unpleasant and painful
3 - I assume without evidence animals don’t have complex internal worlds and desires for things like freedom or long life
4 - I assume the lives animals lead in farms is good
5 - I am a naive utiliarian and see no issues with mere addition/the repugnant conclusion
6 - a quick death does not count negatively in a utiliarian sensw
C - therefore we should breed as many animals as we can, kill them whenever convenient as long as they are not old, and this makes the world better.
I do not see how 1 through 3 connect to 4 through 6. And 4 through 6 is just the repugnant conclusion.
You bookmark my profile, show up randomly to just say nice things to me like this so I feel less like I’m begging into a void (￣▽￣)ノ <3
For real though thanks for the kind words. Because controversy generates engagement saying anything against eating meat gets you inundated with replies, like 1 in 40 of which seem remotely good faith.
I’ve saved your comment, if I’m going through my saved stuff hopefully I’ll remember to look at your stuff again and chime in 🤞😊 in the meantime, keep it up!
Except in rare circumstances, mostly human ones, animals (including humans) don’t want to die, and die anyways.
The best we can give them is a fervent life and a humane death. The meat industry is atrocious at this, and carbon dioxide is a terrible idea - particularly when nitrogen is readily available, humane, and cheap.
I’m not sure how you get “Breeding people to kill them in their prime and eat their bodies” from “death is inevitable”.
Could you step through your chain of reasoning please?
Nature will undoubtedly provide a grisly and cruel death. Animals don’t have a concept of “long, well-lived life full of meaning.” They do have a direct experience of “having food and shelter and being generally free of pain is enjoyable.”
It doesn’t matter if it’s in their prime (before they decline and life becomes difficult) or of it’s after their prime - except that if you wait too long, life starts to suck pretty bad.
If you want to end predation, you’ll have an eternal task on your hands.
That is not a chain of reasoning, would you mind trying again. Step by step please.
It was three distinct points. But it wouldn’t matter if I did reason it out for you - your stance is emotive, and you won’t agree with me unless that viewpoint underlying your stance changes, and it won’t change due to someone reasoning it out for you.
The slow grind of time, and the steady erosion by nature may cause you to change, though. Fortunately, whether it does or not, it’s basically irrelevant to me whether or not you believe or act as I do.
The most charitable read I can see is
1 - everyone dies 2 - I assume without evidence that death is generally unpleasant and painful 3 - I assume without evidence animals don’t have complex internal worlds and desires for things like freedom or long life 4 - I assume the lives animals lead in farms is good 5 - I am a naive utiliarian and see no issues with mere addition/the repugnant conclusion 6 - a quick death does not count negatively in a utiliarian sensw C - therefore we should breed as many animals as we can, kill them whenever convenient as long as they are not old, and this makes the world better.
I do not see how 1 through 3 connect to 4 through 6. And 4 through 6 is just the repugnant conclusion.
Well said. People like you make me wish I could follow users on lemmy
Wait I didn’t even realize you couldn’t follow users on lemmy, huh
Yep, the devs refuse to implement it. There’s an issue on github for it and the recommended solution is “use kbin or mastodon or something else”
You bookmark my profile, show up randomly to just say nice things to me like this so I feel less like I’m begging into a void (￣▽￣)ノ <3
For real though thanks for the kind words. Because controversy generates engagement saying anything against eating meat gets you inundated with replies, like 1 in 40 of which seem remotely good faith.
I’ve saved your comment, if I’m going through my saved stuff hopefully I’ll remember to look at your stuff again and chime in 🤞😊 in the meantime, keep it up!