Politico
I don’t know how anyone can genuinely believe that Republicans are for small government and say the competition is good when they’re using government to stifle competition.
If you know nothing you’ll believe anything.
Follow that with "Anyone who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities”… and you start to get a feel for the playbook the GOP is using
These backward-ass clowns are going to be the bane of this world.
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AFAIK even the heaviest tesla car has basically nothing on what a semi does to a road.
I mean yeah, obviously, but it isn’t a particularly useful comparison since the two aren’t really alternatives to each other.
The damage to the road based on vehicle weight is exponential, though. A very heavy electric car causes very little additional wear to the roads when compared to a traditional car.
Charge road use taxes by vehicle weight. Yes, electric cars are heavy, but so is the average American vehicle, because people seem to love their enormous trucks. If you have a Model 3 or a roadster, it’s actually lighter than the average.
According to U.S. Environmental Protection Agency, the average weight of a car is around 4094 pounds. A small car weighs around 2600 pounds, while a large car weighs around 4400 pounds.
- Tesla Model X Plaid - 5,390 pounds
- Tesla Model X Standard Range - 5,185 pounds
- Tesla Model S Plaid - 4,766 pounds
- Tesla Model S Long Range - 4,561 pounds
- Tesla Model Y Long Range & Performance - 4,416 pounds
- Tesla Model 3 Long Range & Performance - 4,065 pounds
- Tesla Model 3 Standard Range Plus - 3,582 pounds
- Tesla Roadster - 2,723 pounds
You’ve got it right, but let me expand with the power of mathematical modelling. The average vehicle is, for the last 20 years or so, pegged at 4000 lbs when doing road damage calculations. A Chevy bolt EV is around 3800 lbs, or smaller than average, while Tesla vehicles are like you said. The fourth power law is what is used to estimate road damage, and the take away point from that is that all vehicles in and around that 4000 lb range and nothing, notta, moot, compared to large trucks and shipping rigs.
As an example. Take the bolt EV at 3800 lbs, the F150 at 4200 lbs, and the F350 at 6764 lbs.
The bolt and f150 would have 1900lbs and 2100lbs per axle respectively. Applying the fourth power rule the F150 does (2100/1900)^4= 1.49 times the damage of a Bolt EV. Meanwhile the F350 does , (3382/1900)^4 = 10 times the road damage.
So then, is it true that the F150 and F350 will be made to pay 1.5 and 10 times the registration and fuel taxes of an EV like the Bolt? I have not yet seen this to be true. Now imagine how much damage a delivery van, or large shipping vehicle does.
The other part of this is environmental damage, are these states going to find a way to charge for carbon emissions I’m the gas vehicles? Of course not.
In Canada anyway fuel taxes go into general revenue, not to roads, that’s a whole different line of argument.
I’m curious and a nerd about this stuff. Why is road damage estimated using a fourth power law? What is the physical reasoning behind that?
Relevant wiki article : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourth_power_law
TLDR: we experimented in the 50s and this is the model that fit.
With safety regulations, I thought smaller cars are around 2800-3000lbs now. A 7 year old (2016) Mazda 3 (compact car) is showing as 2900lbs. When you say small are you talking like the sub compact cars? Just trying to get an idea of what small means in this instance.
They could just take the money from fossil fuel subsidies. This way, you don’t give people a new reason to not get an EV and we reduce tax revenue used to support the fossil fuel industry.
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Someone downvoted you and the person above you, but the only way to get renewables on par with fossil fuels is to get rid of fossil fuels’ subsidies.
If people are forced to pay the real cost of gas, I imagine things will change rapidly.
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This is why the proposal to add additional tax to tire sales, to replace the missing infrastructure support that gas taxes have traditionally contributed to, has been suggested, instead of lump-sum registration fees for EVs.
The heavier the vehicle, the more damage you contribute to the road and the more you pay, whether it be through more tire replacements or paying for premium tires that last longer. The less you drive, the less you pay.
Tax gas to disincentivize polluting the air we breath and the climate in which we exist. Tax tires to pay for the damages vehicles due to the road based on weight and amount of road use.
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That would have to be one huge payment, though. I can only think of a few cases in my entire life that I’ve bought a tire.
Seems better to me that they collect the taxes from everyone from the income tax and/or business taxes. Everyone uses the roads, even if they don’t have a car.
Really, it’s just a percentage of the cost of the tire. Just like with gas. Avg person drives 10-15k miles per year… 4 tires need to be replaced every 30-60k miles depending on the tires you buy.
You pay less if you drive less. But you also do less damage to the roads.
I would have gone with backward ass-clowns, but both are good.
These backward-ass clowns are
going to bethe bane of this world.
Ah you think downvotes are your ally? You merely adopted the downvotes. I was born in it, molded by it. I didn’t see the upvotes until I was already a boomer, by then it was nothing to me but turmoil!
“We’re moving so fast to electric vehicles, we’re just making the problems worse,” said state Rep. Jim Gooch ®, the longtime chair of Kentucky’s House energy committee. Those problems are multiplying, he added, as public officials look to electrify government fleets — especially transit systems and school districts.
“I certainly don’t want to put my kids on a school bus that’s electric. I just don’t want to do it,” Gooch said. “And I’ll fight in any way I can to make sure that that’s not something Kentucky’s doing.”
What? Why would you not want your kids going on a bus that has zero exhaust? School busses that use diesel straight smell like crap and it’s absolutely hot af in the south. After reading this quote I was like, this world is so fucked.
There’s a guy who is definitely has a hoard of incandesant light bulbs in his garage.
To add to that, does anyone here remember those bus fire drills that you had to do once a year?
I remember having to walk a quarter mile away from the propane buses in case they blew. Much more boomy than the diesel or gasoline buses which would only burn you to death!
In the city where I live, almost all public transport buses are electric. Honestly for a bus it’s so much better than diesel, they’re quiet, don’t vibrate and ride much smoother
They can also leverage regen due to constant stopping, don’t get high drag penalty due to low speeds, etc. seems like good application for EV. Makes no sense as you said.
I’ll tell you why; because oil lobbyists paid him to be against EVs and he has no actual reason to be against EVs.
Kentucky
That explains everything
He’s a conservative. He wants to conserve his oil lobbyists payout.
Fuck this shit, but also did anyone else do a double take when they read this?
“It’s a barrier to adoption,” said Albert Gore, executive director of the Zero Emission Transportation Association, a trade group.
I had to look him up.
Oh no sir, I must say you’re wrong. I’m Gal Bore, absolutely no relation whatsoever to the very handsome former vice president.
Supporters say it ensures every driver pays their fair share. But the fee is nearly double what an average driver would pay in taxes at the pump, according to consumer advocates.
Sounds like the foundation for legal challenges from EV manufacturers.
Can we just invest in public transit while taxing the fuck out of personal vehicles as well as cease subsiding oil, ffs?
That wouldn’t work in the vast majority of the US, which is very spread out.
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Great, but punishing everyone who doesn’t live in a metro by taxing personal vehicles out of existence would be assinine.
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The quote was “tax the fuck out of personal vehicles”. It doesn’t say non-electric personal vehicles.
Original commenter here:
We need the vast majority of personal vehicles to be phased out, please.
Obviously, electric vehicles are a stop-gap, but they’re also part of the problem.
Land doesn’t ride in cars, people do.
Public transit isn’t feasible is many rural areas. I know you don’t like it, but that’s reality. Sending a bus 20 miles down a road in the hopes that one of 4 people on it want to ride on the bus just doesn’t make sense.
Sending a bus 20 miles down a road in the hopes that one of 4 people on it want to ride on the bus just doesn’t make sense.
Super true. I am disappointed bus systems have not started an on-demand system. Uber/Lyft showed what an app could do for transportation. Add physical call buttons at stops, or something, for those without mobile phones.
I would ride the bus more if it went where I need to go.
How about fuck off and spend your own money on shitty transit instead of wasting taxpayer money on it while restricting freedom?
Freedom to get stuck in traffic >>>>
Freedom to pay more in gas than I would for a transit pass.
Freedom to be forced to get a licensed by the government just to move around
So fucking end the licensing. It isn’t rocket science
Freedom to be run over by someone operating a three-ton piece of equipment without proper training and certification
Lmao it’s barely harder than walking
You realize we subside the oil industry with our taxes right?
Edit:
Also
So fucking stop subsidizing it.
I live in one of these states that charges $100 for hybrids annually. Annoying as hell but I save so much on gas that it’s worth it. I get the argument that gas taxes pay for road maintenance, but this whole thing isn’t going to be sustainable in the long run.
The taxes should probably be based on some combination of usage and gross vehicle weight. People driving more with heavy vehicles ought to pay a larger share of road maintenance. A gas tax somewhat handles this since people with larger vehicles who drive more will use more gas.
But the gas taxes don’t even cover all of the money spent on maintaining/upgrading the roads. Roads are very expensive especially when you have these large highway interchange projects. We should really be trying to get people away from driving cars and onto transit, biking, walking etc. as much as possible
But the gas taxes don’t even cover all of the money spent on maintaining/upgrading the roads
This is especially true where I live, because our state police are getting money from the DOT to help police small towns who can’t afford their own.
I imagine they’ll start caring more about road maintenance when they’re so bad nobody can drive fast enough to get a speeding ticket.
But the gas taxes don’t even cover all of the money spent on maintaining/upgrading the roads
They would if we stopped wasting money on entirely unnecessary projects and worthless maintenance.
Except the argument that gas taxes pay for road maintenance is total fucking bogus when you realize how much is spent on entirely unnecessary road maintenance just because of city/state governments in bed with construction companies.
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The real issue is the energy grid as more people move to electric cars. California already has rolling blackouts. What happens when millions more EVs start recharging?
