edit: this is now closed future comments won’t be counted

I keep seeing this instance is overrun with tankies so hey, lets do an informal survey like I’ve seen on hexbear

respond with YES or NO in the first line of your comment and i’ll tally everything in a couple of days, lets say I’ll try and collect everything on the sunday the 9th (10+gmt sorry)

not sure thisll work, be nice, have fun

    • Cowbee [he/him]@lemmy.ml
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      5 months ago

      Marxists and Anarchists share 90% of views, they just disagree on the presence of a government. The natural enemies of both Marxists and Anarchists are liberals and fascists.

  • Jake [he/him]@lemmy.ml
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    5 months ago

    Not one of my pronouns. Never been in a tank. I don’t even own a tank top. It sounds like a sophomoric pejorative neologism. Why would I adopt such a label? No.

  • Katrisia@lemm.ee
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    5 months ago

    My understanding is that tankies believe that groups that have partially or completely followed far-left principles should be exempt from all criticism. I disagree. As long as it is honest criticism, it should not only be allowed but encouraged.

    I’ve also heard that tankies are historic revisionists to an extreme. While I agree Western history is not telling us the real version of things, I don’t think other countries are either. I won’t say that an event happened one way or the other just because country A or country B says so. If historians and other experts are still debating an event and its details, I prefer to watch from a distance as I have no way to contribute to those debates.

    So… no.

  • Fondots@lemmy.world
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    5 months ago

    I’m not from this instance, so probably not totally relevant to this poll, that said

    NO, I’m not a tankie.

    I think, however, it’s worth considering that a lot of people that could be considered tankies probably wouldn’t apply the term to themselves, and that could skew the results of your poll. First of all, tankie is sort of a pejorative term, and many wouldn’t want to apply it to themselves for that reason alone. Secondly a lot of people just may not consider themselves to be a tankie, and genuinely do not recognize their own tankieness.

    I don’t think I’m the guy to come up with a definitive checklist of what does or does not make someone a tankie, but for the sake of getting the conversation going (and feel free to disagree with me here, I welcome the discussion) I think two of the biggest hallmarks of being a tankie are

    1. Communism- not all communists are tankies, but all tankies at least claim to subscribe to some sort of communist ideology.

    2. Authoritarianism- tankies either are authoritarians themselves, or are willing to support or overlook authoritarians as long as they see them as being in some way opposed to “the west”/capitalism/etc.

    I think the authoritarianism aspect is going to trip some people up trying to answer this truthfully. A lot of authoritarians probably wouldn’t consider themselves authoritarians, most people like to think they’re standing for freedom, justice, liberty, equality, etc. even if their actual actions tell another story. Don’t get me wrong, there are people out there who are openly authoritarian and proud of it, but a lot of authoritarians are a little brainwashed to the point they’ve lost sight of what they’re actually supporting (take a look at the MAGA crowd, they think they’re about free speech and anti-censorship but want to keep books they don’t like out of libraries, they think they’re about small government but want to regulate what kind of medical care you can get, they think they stand for law and order but also proudly proclaim that they are all domestic terrorists and have a convicted felon as their poster boy)

    And politics are messy, full of moral grey areas and times where you have to choose between the lesser of two evils, make uncomfortable alliances, difficult choices, and kick some cans further down the road to deal with later while you tackle the current crisis. It’s not always easy or feasible to draw a crisp line in the sand and say “we will not ally with/support/turn a blind eye to these authoritarian regimes,” sometimes you have to play a little bit of the “the enemy of my enemy is my friend” game if you want to actually make any progress against that enemy, or you may have to prioritize and deal with something else before you deal with them. There is a whole lot of grey area to explore about when, why, how, how long, and how much you can support or ignore them before you’re advancing their cause as much or more than your own.

    I think there’s probably some tankies who have been taken for a ride on the propaganda wagon and don’t truly realize how authoritarian they are, and there’s others who have justified it, thinking that they’re only going to be/support authoritarians temporarily to achieve a specific goal and will pivot away from that later, but have gone too far or keep moving the goalposts.

    Couple last thoughts from me.

    There can always be bad actors who are falsely claiming to be (or not to be) tankies for their own purposes. Not really much you can do about that.

    Personally, a lot of the criticism I’ve seen about tankies here has been directed towards the mods and admins, not necessarily the rank average users.

  • ☭ Parabola ☭ @lemmy.ml
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    5 months ago

    YES

    If wanting to receive basic human rights (food, housing, etc.), attend education without being discriminated against for my income and mental condition, control my workplace, earn the full value of my wages, have a government actually controlled by the people, all while being politically educated in past socialist movements and their theory to achieve all these things, then I’m sure as hell am a tankie, and I don’t care what online liberals say.

    Stalin rules, by the way. ✊

    • hash0772@sh.itjust.works
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      5 months ago

      You say you support authoritarianism, and then you say “have a government that is actually controlled by the people”. Are you stupid?

        • hash0772@sh.itjust.works
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          5 months ago

          If we ignored everything they said before because they did supposition, they literally said “Stalin rules”. What part of that doesn’t scream authoritarianism?

          • Cowbee [he/him]@lemmy.ml
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            5 months ago

            Seems more intentionally inflamatory than anything else, considering they literally told you what they wanted before that line.

            What do you believe Tankies actually desire?

            • hash0772@sh.itjust.works
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              5 months ago

              Tankie is a pejorative label generally applied to authoritarian communists, especially those who support acts of repression by such regimes or their allies. – Wikipedia
              I use the label “tankie” on people who support dictators like Stalin and Xi Jinping and actively push for an authoritarian state. Not sure if them putting “Stalin rules, by the way. ✊” was not serious and/or intentionally inflamatory.

              • Cowbee [he/him]@lemmy.ml
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                5 months ago

                They don’t count as a tankie then, they quite plainly told you they wanted a democratically controlled state. Or is democracy authoritarian, in your view?

                • hash0772@sh.itjust.works
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                  5 months ago

                  Nope. As I said, not sure if them putting “Stalin rules, by the way. ✊” was not serious and/or intentionally inflammatory.
                  If they used it seriously, as in supporting Stalin and his acts, don’t they still count as a tankie?

    • prole@sh.itjust.works
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      5 months ago

      Why does Stalin “rule”? This is a question from a fellow “leftist.”

      Either ignorant, or you’re just a really bad person. Just such a stupid fucking thing to say. Take a step back from the Internet and read a book. Saying “Stalin rules ✊” doesn’t make you cool, it just makes you look like an idiot.

      Stalin was a paranoid, murderous dictator responsible for the unnecessary deaths of countless millions of people. Or does it not count because he didn’t murder them himself?

      Can’t wait to hear about how the holomodor wasn’t his fault…