“I don’t speak the language, you do, but I know better than you what is and is not a slur because every language has to work the same”. Frociaggine is hardly a slur, it’s a term that can be used in many contexts without any particular hateful undertone, although this applies to friendly contexts mostly. “frocio” is closer to a slur because it’s more personal, although in Italian is very common for slurs/bad words to be used in a completely different way too (see for example use of “stronzo”) or without the bad connotation. In Rome this phenomenon is particularly common.
You seem to have a colonialist mindset. Your culture/language apparently has to apply anywhere, no differences accepted.
Also, I am a radical leftist who is a full supporter of LGBTQ rights, and I fight the Church in Italy for decades. So you can put down your strawman.
Calling gaslighting telling you about a word that you don’t understand is the cherry on top :)
You can also verify that “mortacci tua” (literally: cursing your dead ancestors) is a slur/cuss, but in Rome it is used 80% as a friendly expression. Just to make an example.
Culture and language exist beyond your google searches…
SHitty people all call their friends queerphobic slurs in both English and Spanish, I’ve seen it.
It doesn’t excuse it, and it doesn’t make their language and behavior less queerphobic. In fact, the fact that they use it so casually is just more evidence of how deeply entrenched queerphobia is, and the fact that they’re willing to continue to normalize this in society with such callous disgregard for us LGBTQIA+ people does not reflect well on their character.
Sounds to me like you just surround yourself with 4chan tier people. Yikes.
Frociaggine is not a word that refers to a person. Frocio is, and I mentioned that while it is sometimes used without hatred, the latter is more generally a slur. Frociaggine/frociata is also very used to describe something flamboyant. It is a bit heavier than that, but definitely far from “fag…tness”.
I explained this already, but you didn’t want to read " the essay", so here I am repeating myself.
fact, the fact that they use it so casually is just more evidence of how deeply entrenched queerphobia
Or maybe it’s evidence that cultures and languages are differently and evolved differently, and not everything has to model to the English (American) version?
I already made an example for insults which are used completely in a friendly way, you can have other examples in religious people god-swearing (something that doesn’t even exist in most languages).
The fact that while you don’t belong to the culture, do not speak the language but pretend to be authoritative about what the language is or should be is honestly hilarious.
Now, is the pope queerphobic? Very likely, but because it’s the head of a queerphobic institution who has a queerphobic posture since ever, not because he used frociaggine.
Anyway, here’s you straight up refusing to understand the concept of white privilege:
My genuine reaction to everything you’ve said:
Have an extremely shitty day, and let’s not talk again. I have even less respect for you now that when we’ve started – pretty impressive tbh since I started at zero so – achievement unlocked??, and you’ve confirmed all my suspicions about you by admitting that you think casual queerphobia is okay and that we queers are just “making a big deal out of nothing.”
I can’t block your ass because I’m a mod, but I won’t be responding in any meaningful way going forward.
Oh no, a comment in another context again interpreted from your US-centric view!
I mean, you think I care about your respect? A person who makes 0 effort in understanding other points of views (quite similar, ironically) and straight up insults and wishes death to others? Lol you are thinking way too much of yourself.
I also stand by every word of that comment, as the concept of white privilege doesn’t apply everywhere (Italy has a completely different history and racial dynamic compared to US).
Again, you have a colonialist mindset, and you are completely incapable of accepting that the US cultural lens is not the only lens that exists and that won’t apply to many.
So tell whatever stories you want to yourself, shout as much as you can, but I am just explaining my views and providing cultural context (which has nothing to do with excusing or defending homophobia). You refuse to accept this context because you think that your perspective is universal. I will repeat it, colonialist mindset.
“I don’t speak the language, you do, but I know better than you what is and is not a slur because every language has to work the same”. Frociaggine is hardly a slur, it’s a term that can be used in many contexts without any particular hateful undertone, although this applies to friendly contexts mostly. “frocio” is closer to a slur because it’s more personal, although in Italian is very common for slurs/bad words to be used in a completely different way too (see for example use of “stronzo”) or without the bad connotation. In Rome this phenomenon is particularly common.
You seem to have a colonialist mindset. Your culture/language apparently has to apply anywhere, no differences accepted.
Also, I am a radical leftist who is a full supporter of LGBTQ rights, and I fight the Church in Italy for decades. So you can put down your strawman.
Calling gaslighting telling you about a word that you don’t understand is the cherry on top :)
I’m not reading an essay from a straight person who sounds like a redditor
You are not reading at all, apparently. Shame, it’s useful sometimes. You should try.
Your opinion here is unimportant. You’re not in the community
So your opinion on the use of an Italian word is not important, as you are not in the community (Italian speakers). Sounds good to me.
(Obviously I consider your argument BS, but happy to apply it both ways).
Anyone can easily determine it’s a slur. Pretty fuckin easy to verify that I’m right and you’re wrong.
You can also verify that “mortacci tua” (literally: cursing your dead ancestors) is a slur/cuss, but in Rome it is used 80% as a friendly expression. Just to make an example.
Culture and language exist beyond your google searches…
SHitty people all call their friends queerphobic slurs in both English and Spanish, I’ve seen it.
It doesn’t excuse it, and it doesn’t make their language and behavior less queerphobic. In fact, the fact that they use it so casually is just more evidence of how deeply entrenched queerphobia is, and the fact that they’re willing to continue to normalize this in society with such callous disgregard for us LGBTQIA+ people does not reflect well on their character.
Sounds to me like you just surround yourself with 4chan tier people. Yikes.
Frociaggine is not a word that refers to a person. Frocio is, and I mentioned that while it is sometimes used without hatred, the latter is more generally a slur. Frociaggine/frociata is also very used to describe something flamboyant. It is a bit heavier than that, but definitely far from “fag…tness”.
I explained this already, but you didn’t want to read " the essay", so here I am repeating myself.
Or maybe it’s evidence that cultures and languages are differently and evolved differently, and not everything has to model to the English (American) version?
I already made an example for insults which are used completely in a friendly way, you can have other examples in religious people god-swearing (something that doesn’t even exist in most languages). The fact that while you don’t belong to the culture, do not speak the language but pretend to be authoritative about what the language is or should be is honestly hilarious. Now, is the pope queerphobic? Very likely, but because it’s the head of a queerphobic institution who has a queerphobic posture since ever, not because he used frociaggine.
Anyway, here’s you straight up refusing to understand the concept of white privilege:
My genuine reaction to everything you’ve said:
Have an extremely shitty day, and let’s not talk again. I have even less respect for you now that when we’ve started – pretty impressive tbh since I started at zero so – achievement unlocked??, and you’ve confirmed all my suspicions about you by admitting that you think casual queerphobia is okay and that we queers are just “making a big deal out of nothing.”
I can’t block your ass because I’m a mod, but I won’t be responding in any meaningful way going forward.
Oh no, a comment in another context again interpreted from your US-centric view!
I mean, you think I care about your respect? A person who makes 0 effort in understanding other points of views (quite similar, ironically) and straight up insults and wishes death to others? Lol you are thinking way too much of yourself.
I also stand by every word of that comment, as the concept of white privilege doesn’t apply everywhere (Italy has a completely different history and racial dynamic compared to US).
Again, you have a colonialist mindset, and you are completely incapable of accepting that the US cultural lens is not the only lens that exists and that won’t apply to many. So tell whatever stories you want to yourself, shout as much as you can, but I am just explaining my views and providing cultural context (which has nothing to do with excusing or defending homophobia). You refuse to accept this context because you think that your perspective is universal. I will repeat it, colonialist mindset.