I’m a Data Scientist working my first job since my masters, where I’ve had an extremely successful last 2.5 years at my employer with the different projects I’ve done. I don’t think I’m making very much though, only $78K. In addition, due to a coworker leaving all my time is being spent doing simple SQL reporting that isn’t developing my skill set, and the company isn’t hiring a replacement.
I recently applied to a position posted by a recruitment agency and got an interview with them. It would be a for a 12 month contract but the pay would be around $150K if I got it. In addition the work would be more senior and relevant in the sense that I’d be basically building their data science capabilities from scratch. Being self-employed I’d have to take care of paying taxes, the employer portion of CPP, etc. - but for that increase in pay I’d be crazy to not take it, right?
It’s also worth mentioning that I have fairly minimal monthly expenses and about $100K in savings in case something goes wrong, so it’s not like I’d be risking a mortgage or anything terrible if something went wrong.
78k seems very under paid for data science work (my knowledge of this is limited).
On its face it seems like yes you’d have to be crazy not to take it.
To get a more in depth answer you should probably calculate what the actual difference is. Ie factor insurance ( medical dental) rrsp contributions etc. Then you’ll have a much better sense of the difference.
It probably doesn’t hurt to ask for a higher rate than they are offering in anycase, I’d def look at what other data science people are making.
Hi hi. Engineer here that has moonlit in the past using incorporated entities.
First, I agree with the other commenter that your existing wage appears low. Better market understanding would be good here.
Second, a good ‘rule of thumb’ for your indirect expenses (rrsp, cra, ei, insurance) is 35% on top of a full time salary. So, if your salary today is 78, your indirect expenses (which your employer currently bears) takes that up to 105.3k. Add your incorporation costs, annual filings (including unaudited statements), and setup costs (IT equipment, payroll, etc.) that’s going to take you to 110/115. Don’t forget that you will be over HST reporting minimums so you will need to register, collect, and remit GST / provincial sales tax.
A guaranteed 150 for 12 months seems to make financial sense, just consider whether you can build a pipeline of later work (with your enhanced skillset) during that time.
I think a lot of people incorporate when they don’t need to. If you are working for one client, why would you absolutely have to incorporate? If you have appropriate insurance in place, that’s a god awful amount of work to do for kinda questionable reasons. It can act as a tax deferral, but you gotta pay it at some point. And people’s incomes mostly go up, so unless you are like >57 years old, I’ve never really bought the income deferral argument. The integration will get you on dividends. So what’s the point?
Just my two cents. Not saying it’s right, but for simple self employment, yeah I’ve never fully understood…
Few things: your pay is low for your experience and education. You’re also not using your skills, so I think you can do much much better at a new job (looking at $130k salary min).
That offer sounds more reasonable, but please share more details about why you’re self employed. Is this a contracting role for a US firm, in which case I think your pay could be higher. Is it limited contract?
You probably shouldn’t incorporate, it’s expensive and doesn’t help your tax situation at all. You’re better off being sole proprietor. Double check with an accountant to be sure (should be answerable for your situation in a 30 min call). The other advice on overhead is good. For taxes you need to be aware that even as a contractor the CRA may decide you’re an employee and go after you and your employer for CPP.
In addition, depending on the company and contract you will want to buy professional liability insurance. PIPEDA, GDPR, and CCPA are serious business, make sure you’re not exposed to liability through your services, which is why you should look at insurance (friend on the role).
Next I would dig a little deeper on kick starting their DS capabilities from scratch. That’s a tough gig, I’ve done it a couple of times and it can be fun or horrible. It’s going to be a lot of selling data science to teams you need to work with, they won’t always want to make time for you, so be ready for that.
Think about how much support you’ll have, do they have a data warehouse, any infrastructure, or an existing analytics team? If so, you’re good to do DS, if not, you’re going to need to build a lot of tooling and reporting before you do much DS work. Personally I love that stuff, but it’s technical work.
You’ll also have to demonstrate value, so how are they expecting you to do that? Do you build data products, do you do product analytics, ML? It’s important to scope that out and set those expectations with your boss, that will help make sure you’re successful. Always always always make sure your boss knows why you’re valuable and why they’re cutting you your paycheque.
Edit: I missed the part about 12 month contract. You should have the best tax liability as sole prop contractor.
Something to consider, so I pretty much was in the same scenario you are in, but seven years ago. I took the contract, the money, and the several skipped steps promotion. I don’t want to say it was a mistake, it wasn’t, and I had a helluva experience. But I wasnt quite ready for the fallout afterwards.
I decided to not renew the contract, and I’ll save you all the details, but I ran into a bit of a downturn and it took me almost a full year to find employment after, and I basically had to go back to the level I was at before I left. It took me a few years to get caught back up. Again, it was an awesome experience, I don’t regret it, but I’m not sure I’d do the same thing again. I’d honestly look for something a bit more firmed up than 12 months, even if it’s for a bit less money. I’m not saying don’t make a move. But if I could find something perm, with benefits and RRSP matching and all of that for say $120-125k, I’d sooner take that over the $150k open ended.
Also if it’s for a recruiter, it’s probably awful. Just be warned. If they have to get a recruiter, they had to for a reason. Not saying it’s not legit, but just keep one eye open. Recruiters lie like rugs too, until you have an offer in your hand to sign, trust them about as far as you can throw them. They overpromise and grossly under deliver.
Thanks for the advice! I’m definitely taking everything said with a huge grain of salt and I’m going to demand some of the non-monetary aspects be put into the contract (like the rules around working remotely). I’m also actively applying to other positions too - I’m hoping I’ll find something more reliable.
I’m a Data Scientist working my first job since my masters, where I’ve had an extremely successful last 2.5 years at my employer with the different projects I’ve done. I don’t think I’m making very much though, only $78K. In addition, due to a coworker leaving all my time is being spent doing simple SQL reporting that isn’t developing my skill set, and the company isn’t hiring a replacement.
I recently applied to a position posted by a recruitment agency and got an interview with them. It would be a for a 12 month contract but the pay would be around $150K if I got it. In addition the work would be more senior and relevant in the sense that I’d be basically building their data science capabilities from scratch. Being self-employed I’d have to take care of paying taxes, the employer portion of CPP, etc. - but for that increase in pay I’d be crazy to not take it, right?
It’s also worth mentioning that I have fairly minimal monthly expenses and about $100K in savings in case something goes wrong, so it’s not like I’d be risking a mortgage or anything terrible if something went wrong.
78k seems very under paid for data science work (my knowledge of this is limited).
On its face it seems like yes you’d have to be crazy not to take it.
To get a more in depth answer you should probably calculate what the actual difference is. Ie factor insurance ( medical dental) rrsp contributions etc. Then you’ll have a much better sense of the difference.
It probably doesn’t hurt to ask for a higher rate than they are offering in anycase, I’d def look at what other data science people are making.
Hi hi. Engineer here that has moonlit in the past using incorporated entities.
First, I agree with the other commenter that your existing wage appears low. Better market understanding would be good here.
Second, a good ‘rule of thumb’ for your indirect expenses (rrsp, cra, ei, insurance) is 35% on top of a full time salary. So, if your salary today is 78, your indirect expenses (which your employer currently bears) takes that up to 105.3k. Add your incorporation costs, annual filings (including unaudited statements), and setup costs (IT equipment, payroll, etc.) that’s going to take you to 110/115. Don’t forget that you will be over HST reporting minimums so you will need to register, collect, and remit GST / provincial sales tax.
A guaranteed 150 for 12 months seems to make financial sense, just consider whether you can build a pipeline of later work (with your enhanced skillset) during that time.
Hope that helps.
I think a lot of people incorporate when they don’t need to. If you are working for one client, why would you absolutely have to incorporate? If you have appropriate insurance in place, that’s a god awful amount of work to do for kinda questionable reasons. It can act as a tax deferral, but you gotta pay it at some point. And people’s incomes mostly go up, so unless you are like >57 years old, I’ve never really bought the income deferral argument. The integration will get you on dividends. So what’s the point?
Just my two cents. Not saying it’s right, but for simple self employment, yeah I’ve never fully understood…
Few things: your pay is low for your experience and education. You’re also not using your skills, so I think you can do much much better at a new job (looking at $130k salary min).
That offer sounds more reasonable, but please share more details about why you’re self employed. Is this a contracting role for a US firm, in which case I think your pay could be higher. Is it limited contract?
You probably shouldn’t incorporate, it’s expensive and doesn’t help your tax situation at all. You’re better off being sole proprietor. Double check with an accountant to be sure (should be answerable for your situation in a 30 min call). The other advice on overhead is good. For taxes you need to be aware that even as a contractor the CRA may decide you’re an employee and go after you and your employer for CPP.
In addition, depending on the company and contract you will want to buy professional liability insurance. PIPEDA, GDPR, and CCPA are serious business, make sure you’re not exposed to liability through your services, which is why you should look at insurance (friend on the role).
Next I would dig a little deeper on kick starting their DS capabilities from scratch. That’s a tough gig, I’ve done it a couple of times and it can be fun or horrible. It’s going to be a lot of selling data science to teams you need to work with, they won’t always want to make time for you, so be ready for that.
Think about how much support you’ll have, do they have a data warehouse, any infrastructure, or an existing analytics team? If so, you’re good to do DS, if not, you’re going to need to build a lot of tooling and reporting before you do much DS work. Personally I love that stuff, but it’s technical work.
You’ll also have to demonstrate value, so how are they expecting you to do that? Do you build data products, do you do product analytics, ML? It’s important to scope that out and set those expectations with your boss, that will help make sure you’re successful. Always always always make sure your boss knows why you’re valuable and why they’re cutting you your paycheque.
Edit: I missed the part about 12 month contract. You should have the best tax liability as sole prop contractor.
Something to consider, so I pretty much was in the same scenario you are in, but seven years ago. I took the contract, the money, and the several skipped steps promotion. I don’t want to say it was a mistake, it wasn’t, and I had a helluva experience. But I wasnt quite ready for the fallout afterwards.
I decided to not renew the contract, and I’ll save you all the details, but I ran into a bit of a downturn and it took me almost a full year to find employment after, and I basically had to go back to the level I was at before I left. It took me a few years to get caught back up. Again, it was an awesome experience, I don’t regret it, but I’m not sure I’d do the same thing again. I’d honestly look for something a bit more firmed up than 12 months, even if it’s for a bit less money. I’m not saying don’t make a move. But if I could find something perm, with benefits and RRSP matching and all of that for say $120-125k, I’d sooner take that over the $150k open ended.
Also if it’s for a recruiter, it’s probably awful. Just be warned. If they have to get a recruiter, they had to for a reason. Not saying it’s not legit, but just keep one eye open. Recruiters lie like rugs too, until you have an offer in your hand to sign, trust them about as far as you can throw them. They overpromise and grossly under deliver.
Thanks for the advice! I’m definitely taking everything said with a huge grain of salt and I’m going to demand some of the non-monetary aspects be put into the contract (like the rules around working remotely). I’m also actively applying to other positions too - I’m hoping I’ll find something more reliable.