In July, Lockheed Martin completed the build of NASA’s X-59 test aircraft, which is designed to turn sonic booms into mere thumps, in the hope of making overland supersonic flight a possibility. Ground tests and a first test flight are planned for later in the year. NASA aims to have enough data to hand over to US regulators in 2027.
We need bullet trains, not more passenger jets.
Just what we needed, another pointless carbon-guzzling ride to amuse the undeserving rich.
I’m interested to see how this plane performs compared to the Concord. It’ll be interesting to find out how bad the maintenance will be.
Also the criticism and the “whatabout other important things” people commenting here should know that more than one type of research can be performed at the same time. This is an aerodynamics problem. The other problems related pollution from engines, fuel sources, and environmental impact are also being worked in parallel. A planet of 8 billion people is able to work on many problems and ideas in parallel without having one be a detriment over another. It’s not like an aeronautical engineer can be repurposed to be a fuel chemist!
I swear if firefighting wasn’t currently publicly funded, you’d argue against making it publicly funded because it might not be profitable
Back to work peasant!
I like the technological idea, but not the idea of catering to the super rich by giving them convenience at the cost of increasing their carbon footprint by another order or magnitude. This is tax money funding toys for the parasitic criminal billionaires.
Technology filters down. Once upon a time only the rich could afford corrective lenses, but that wasn’t a waste of resources. How many of non-wealthy people will read this comment and wear glasses or contacts? I do. BEVs were limited to the wealthy at first too, and now are solidly affordable to much of the middle class: dependent more on their access to charging and their driving requirements than on their budget. The first residential fridges cost more than a brand new Model T when they came out: the inflation adjusted price was ~$13,000 in 1922. Was inventing fridges worthless?
It’s NASA developing new technologies. New stuff starts off more expensive, which means it will start off limited to the wealthy. If you don’t want any new tech to come out that starts with rich people being the primary users, then you should go find your local luddite club to join.
I see where you’re coming from. Battery electric vehicles I think are a good example of trickle-down. It seems the R&D for electric cars affordable to wealthy people leads to new infra and tech for a changing power grid, buses, trains and bicycles.
But two examples you raised:
- corrective lenses
- refrigeration
have clear quality-of-life and health benefits. Supersonic passenger flights feel more like a luxury and convenience compared to food preservation.
Hopefully in the development of reduced flight times between other sides of the world we perform research with impact beyond flight. Things like improved materials, fuel, aerodynamics that could be used for trains and trucks. I’m not an engineer but I hope it works like that!
Faster transportation is quality of life too. Just like cars were, or railroads before them. Yeah, this one is currently worthless for anyone that isn’t rich. But if it proves successful it will become useful for more of us. Like you say, there’s also just the material and other sciences being done to make it possible that will filter out elsewhere. So much of early space exploration was Cold War dick waving, and now think about how much we rely on satellites. I couldn’t navigate anywhere without GPS, personally…
People here take their hate of the rich (which is well placed) and aim it at all the wrong things. Don’t like the rich? Tax 'em more. That’s what I want. Higher income taxes and even a wealth tax on the top. And way more meaningful inheritance taxes. Instead they’re bitching about investments in science.
Instead they’re bitching about investments in science.
Agreed. To be fair, I can also see where the frustration comes from. We see “deals with the devil” being made, but the (disappointing?) reality is tech progress often looks like that. Flashy stories with pie-in-the-sky ideas get headlines and funding. Meanwhile the boring, difficult work continues on in the background. From the outside it seems non-sensical and inefficient: why couldn’t they just invest money directly into GPS research without all the military stuff? But, fortunately, some amazing stuff does come out of it too.
yes tech filters down. however this is unneeded imho. we need cleaner transport not faster.
This is wrong. NASA from the beginning was co-opted by the MIC owned by the original billionaires with a tissue thin veil about civilization advancement. Any discussion about super-sonic flight has already dismissed environmental impact and economic accessibility even if it’s ostensibly NASA doing it.
IF there was a supersonic capable flight technology that somehow wasn’t reliant on fossil fuels or other externalities and was cheap enough that a minimum wage worker could use them as often as they use the Subway in the top 10 largest cities in the world, then I’d be 100% behind it. But that isn’t the case, that is not the intended case, and that will never be the case.
First point there is carbon neutral jet fuel because NASA have been working of jet fuel chemistry for decades.
Secondly flying isn’t commuting, people don’t need to go to new cities twice a day but being cheap enough to allow people on minimum wage to have a holiday a few times a year would be a great benefit to all.
“You should be thankful that the rich get to destroy the planet at the literal expense of the rest of us”
Don’t you bootlickers ever get tired of the taste of leather?
This is tax money funding toys for the parasitic criminal billionaires.
What an idiotic and short-sighted take. Research on supersonic aerodynamics is useful for far more than just toys for billionaires. Military applications, rocketry and astrophysics, for example. And even regular commercial aviation, because supersonic shockwaves are a major source of drag even at the speeds airliners fly at. Airlines would kill to have a fleet of planes that burns a few percent less fuel.
E: Also, much of the noise an airliner makes during takeoff comes from the sonic booms created by the engine fan blades going supersonic.
Ffs it’s nasa not blue origin. Do we really have to fight anti nasa shills now ffs, it really is like Nixon all over again after Trump ffs.
america will do anything but invest in public transport huh
How about bitch about the actual wasteful military spending instead of scientific research into physics and understanding the dynamics of sonic booms. Nasa has like .1% of the military budget ffs.
US defense budget was 752.9B for 2022, whereas NASA’s was 24.8B
So NASA’s funding amounts to 3.29% of the Defense budget (about 1/30)
https://www.nasa.gov/sites/default/files/atoms/files/fy2022_budget_summary.pdf
I agree with you, but it’s nice to nail down the numbers
Airplanes are public transportation though
Public transportation is run by the State.
So there are very few countries where trains or buses are public transport?
I mean ig but u know what I mean
trains, busses and shit
lAre you going to ride the bus from NYC to L.A.?
Just because buses and trains don’t make sense for trans continental journeys, doesn’t mean they can’t be used for shorter journeys. There’s a bunch of areas in North America where is does make sense and could eliminate many flights.
nah but a high speed train
It would still take you 2-3 days, assuming normal operation with stops along the way. If the fastest train that exists on the planet right now ran from NYC to L.A. and was able to go from 0 to top speed instantly, and maintain that speed the entire trip, it would still take 10 hours to get there. Trains don’t operate that way though, so realistically it’s 3 days worth of travel. It’s almost 3000 miles to cross the USA.
Trans and busses and shit can cross oceans?
There are technologies already starting to roll out which will make flying the least ecologically damaging means of public transport for long and medium length journeys, I wrote a comment about it already but they’re building a faculty that turns captured carbon into jet fuel it’s really clever stuff.
yeah but captured carbon gas is stupid expensive, and I imagine it’ll be worse for jet fuel. porsches recaptured carbon gas is like $40 a gallon
The first computers cost millions and the one I’m holding in my hand is basically worthlesss. capture and conversion are both fairly simple processes so we will see a lot of reduction in cost once engineering pathways are established especially when tied to excess power generation from renewables - instead of wasting excess capacity divert it to a nearby carbon capture plant.
If a system like this manages to make fuel cheaper than standard fuel types then we’ll see them spring up everywhere, it could be a total game changer. Worse ways there’s an expensive alternative for use cases where electric planes aren’t feasible and we learn a lot about atmospheric carbon in the process.
The air force have been doing studies and they’re really keen on it, fuel security is the main reason but it wouldn’t have got this far if it wasn’t at least somewhat economically viable.
I agree with you 100% that it will get cheaper, though I think that gas will soon be something only rich people can afford for their fancy cars. the rest of us peasants will be stuck with our shitty electric cars
Or it’s own people. Which is stupid, because the brain drain will catch up technology wise.
By investing into research of this airplane, the bulk of the costs are going to be manhours.
How is paying engineers going to cause brain drain?
We can tell it’s already effecting you by trying to suggest nasa is a waste, when we spend 100 times it’s budget on wasted military contracts or the fact we do have a tax bracket that allows someone to even become a billionaire instead of taking back excessive wealth stolen from workers in predatory labor markets. There are other areas we should be getting this money for the public and it sure as hell shouldn’t be from aeronautic or space research ffs.
that’s actually a very good point
Also NASA has created endless bits of research that benefit everyone and the economy, the fact I’m typing this from my phone is only really possible because NASA ‘wasted’ money going to space.
Ah yes, public transportation. Totally suitable for making trans-Atlantic trips in as little as 90 minutes. You know, the thing the article says they would like to achieve.
Instead of more luxury boondoggles for the rich, funded with tax money from people who will never afford it, how about we focus on decarbonizing air travel for the commoners? Fuck supersonic flight, use public money to develop a hydrogen powered regular speed transoceanic airliner so that regular people can have a sustainable long haul air travel option instead of making the carbon footprint of the rich even higher.
Flying used to be a “luxury boondoggle for the rich” same with a lot of things that we view as common today.
We aren’t functioning on the same timescale or known factors as the Wright Brothers were.
The Concorde was a “luxury boondoggle for the rich” and it failed hard. Nobody wants a repeat of that which is why the new goal for supersonic travel is to become cheap and quiet.
This is the focus of the Sustainable Flight Demonstrator, so it’s not like NASA isn’t working on that problem too for what it’s worth.
how about we focus on decarbonizing air travel for the commoners? Fuck supersonic flight
No fuck you peasant, we gonna have the rich flying in supersonic flightrs and there’s nothing you can do about it
oh god
how can you be so based?
Tankie - “Ermegurd look at captialdumism be so wasteful with experdumental fly machine”
Also Tankie - “Hurr durr make moar shitty tank for glorious workers, no need make food”.
what if concorde but more technology
Techbro concorde.
Elon Musk’s jumping onboard any second now.
I wonder if research into sonic boom physics could translate over to high speed aerodynamics generally, to include the useful models for high speed trains.
Interesting thought; I’d hope so. Maybe some material physics/chemistry research that makes some stuff cheaper for trains (I’m not an engineer so totally out of my depth here).
Efficient High-speed rails are already possible and have been since the 70s, it’s not a lack of science that stops them from being a thing, it’s a lack of desire from government officials being paid by private interests to do things less efficiently because people are getting paid.
A quarter billion dollars to build just a prototype and retread the Concorde fiasco with all its attendant environmental destruction. What does this have to do with exploring space, which is what I thought was NASA’s mission?
National Aeronautics and Space Administration
Atmospheric based praise have always been within their purview. Space just gets all the press.
Fair point. It’s still striking to me how much public money is being thrown at a project that will benefit just a handful of private citizens.
Why is it striking to you that A government funded by billionaires for billionaires is spending public funds on things that will only benefit billionaires?
Climate science doesnt have much to do with spaceflight either. Are you complaining about that too?
I am. We have enough problems here, and there is an enormous amount of climate damage for every rocket sent to space.
Fair play to ya. fair play.
What does this have to do with exploring space, which is what I thought was NASA’s mission?
I mean look, it’s cool that they’re doing this and all, and the idea or a trans Atlantic flight in 3 hours is neat for sure … but air travel is already really damn fast, could we focus on making it less shit in other ways?
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Can we get the carbon footprint down so it doesn’t contribute so much to the end of the world?
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Can we cut fuel costs significantly so it doesn’t have to be so miserably expensive?
Good news, they’re building a really cool new facility in washing state which uses carbon captured from the air to create jet fuel, the big idea is when the wind is blowing hard and there’s spare power from turbines they ramp up sequestering carbon from their air and the process of turning it into jet fuel meaning they can make use of power that would otherwise be over capacity by creating carbon neutral jet fuel.
The air force tested it in all their engines and it works great, of course it’ll take time to build the faculty and surrounding infrastructure but it’s a huge development, especially as it’s not a hugely complex tech so we might well see it evolved into being relatively cheap to build - maybe even we’ll see airports making use of their vast amounts of surface area with solar panels and creating carbon neutral jet fuel in site - would be a huge infrastructure saving and create more of a market for carbon which could drive carbon capture projects.
One exciting possibility is an experimental faculty in Cambridgeshire, UK which burns biomas to generate power and uses a fraction of that power to capture carbon from the burnt material - it appears to be a really effective way of pulling carbon from the air so if automated construction and management allow us to get the costs down to a point where it rapidly pays for itself while also making power and collecting carbon then we could well see something like that built at every airport in the world.
This would vastly reduce the carbon footprint of air travel to make it far better than other options for long and medium journeys while also reducing cost by cutting the need for hugely expensive oil mining and refining infrastructure, plus they’d have to remove eco taxes from air trave.
Tl;Dr - they’re already working on that, if we manage to make flying carbon neutral then a faster turn around time on jets is also a good thing ecologically and costwise because we could have less of them in fleets meaning resource costs are lower.
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Well you still need to figure out the sonic boom too, ffs you anti science people are fucking morons.
JFC, can we have a carbon tax already?
Just last month I heard of United’s own supersonic plan ‘Boom’. Concerning name aside I am interested to read more about the tech behind it.
