Zhao says having data on how people who did get the money actually spent it is something she thinks will help counteract stereotypes, increase empathy and potentially get skeptics and the public on board with the idea of providing cash transfers.
Now that the study is complete, the plan is to replicate it and expand it to other cities in Canada and the U.S.
The study ignored people with addictions, people with mental illness, and street entrenched (chronically homeless with nowhere else to go) individuals.
I think what they did was good and is encouraging, but it kind of dilutes its own message that “Homeless people are not what you think!” by ignoring the people who are what everyone thinks of.
It’s important to note that a housing-first approach is the gold standard for care. Getting people off the street into a safe, stable, living environment then allows everything else to follow.
If handing out cash gets that to happen, hey, it’s money we’ll spent. But I’m guessing… just handing a wad of cash doesn’t help as much as we might think- even if that is a few months rent.
Most places require prior addresses and such.
It’s a multifaceted problem and will require multiple solutions to address. Those are always the most difficult solutions because they’re expensive up front and may not show results immediately.
But we find no problem in handing out corporate welfare to banks and oil companies to the tune of billions of dollar per year.
It excluded people’s stereotypes about homeless people and showed how much of a difference $7,500 can make in the lives of most homeless people.
Tackling stigma is an issue but really wasn’t the purpose of the study.
Did you read the next part as well?
“Still, Zhao says having data on how people who did get the money actually spent it is something she thinks will help counteract stereotypes, increase empathy and potentially get skeptics and the public on board with the idea of providing cash transfers.”
right, but its kinds weird to say "lets give these almost-destitute people money in the hopes that it will create empathy to help those that are actually destitute’… like, were So close!
and honestly, watching these programs for a bit now… its not necessarily the exact resources (money/shelter) you give people with these problems. its the social support network you create around them that really lifts them up. the only way out of these pits are continual, supportive human contact
I just wanted to say this is the kind of comments that make Lemmy better than reddit! I had to dig to the very bottom of the reddit post for someone to point this out versus this being the top comment on Lemmy.
Note: I am all for helping homeless people, but excluding information in the title makes this seem like ‘if we give every homeless person $7,500 we can solve homelessness!’ I wish that was the case, but homelessness is a much more complicated issue
I think what they did do in the study was great. They found that the vast majority of homeless people are there because of temporary circumstances, and that money is a direct fix for many people.
But the conclusion they drew is a bit simplistic. Presumably they will need to try other interventions in the groups not studied - such as addiction programs for those struggling with addictions - to fully serve this population.
Here’s the thing … we don’t actually do anything to help unhoused people so why not try something like this? Too bad for us that we make money more important that human life.
40+ years ago some economists got together and created a study on guaranteed income. It worked, but unfortunately no one continued it because we’ve become so entrenched in the ideology of Reagan/Thatcher (article here).
I don’t think it’s possible to live on the streets and not end up with either a mental health issue or some form of dependency as a coping mechanism.
Yeah, it’s already hard enough not to struggle with mental health as is, even in materially good conditions, and then you add onto that losing everything and being forced to live on the streets with everything that brings? Maybe without even having any form for food security?
You are in a straight up survival situation. And it may be especially painful because you’re not alone out in the wilderness…
You’re surrounded by people. Many of whom are very well off. You are surrounded by people who have a home, food, luxuries, and everything, and you cannot have any of that. You’re not allowed to, by society.
It’s a goddamn nightmare. No fucking shit people struggle or just straight up break. I would too.
Those issues are a lack of Healthcare and not a lack of personal resources.
At the same time, is isn’t fair to say all homeless people are the same and lump someone who lost their job then had a medical emergency and can’t dig out with someone who is severely mentally ill with no access to the kind of mental health services they need. There are different reasons that people might be homeless and the way they handle an infusion of cash will sometimes differ. Yes, a person with a heroin addiction might spend money on heroin. Does that mean we should just let all homeless people rot?
Not at all. I think a good program would include financial assistance and social worker involvement for all homeless people, along with addiction resources for those who struggle with it.
I am surprised it led to only 99 days fewer in homelessness compared to the control group that didn’t receive money. But I suppose it just shows how fucked the current housing market is.
$2,000 for 200 square feet: TikTok of Vancouver rental raises hackles
You can see how that money can disappear after a few months, not because the person made bad choices but because of how predatory corporate landlords are. These are tiny apartments, in what was previously the affordable area of town, (which is still a sketchy area but now also unaffordable).
Yeah but if you have no job and no home, it is kinda the perfect time to move to a more affordable state/city.
That is true… and also until recently I didn’t know how crazy expensive even just moving yourself is, either.
A bus from Vancouver to Lethbridge (where it’s $1000/mo rent in places more spacious) is $250. Probably could barely get half of that in a month of begging… There is hitchhiking and walking, and for one homeless guy I met he told me it took over a month to go that distance.
Most homeless people have employment lapses that make it hard to find work, even with an address and fresh clothing. Aswell as possibly still having debts that led them to lose housing in the first place.
In other words, $7,500 is a great start, but as you said, $7,500 doesn’t go far with recent cost of living inflation. And as I mentioned, getting back on your feet isn’t easy because employers aren’t quick to hire the recently homeless.
It won’t significantly affect as the stereotype is for justification of cruelty and not because of logical error.
Not necessarily. I think most people actually don’t know these things.
And you think folks even know stereotypes they don’t care about? The stereotype only exists as a thing in the minds of People that want them to be true.
Yeah sure. I know plenty of stereotypes that I don’t have an incentive to be true.
Those are sterotypes you care about. I said nothing about incentive to be true. Perhaps keep your words in your own mouth rather than claiming they are in another’s? The ones wanting it to be true are the ones you learned them from and only because you cared.
Wtf are you talking about? No they aren’t, yes you did, and how about you learn to communicate properly instead of getting mad when people interpret your unreadable word salad the wrong way?
Tell yourself whatever lies you need to feel better. Focus upon your own emotions rather than project them on others.
You’re delusional and I’m going to stop talking to you, bye
-The study did not include people who are street-entrenched or who have serious addictions or mental health issues -it was tested in Canada
Now wait for the difference result from the difference of population 🤡
Oh the ‘throw money at it’ solution to the problem that everyone online loves so much.
These solutions never work, btw. But let’s keep ‘experimenting’
These solutions never work
Source?
Welfare was supposed to do this already. What welfare has turned into is a perpetual poverty situation for millions of people.
To the point where people are disincentivized to work, and perpetually stay on welfare.
https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2023/07/19/what-the-data-says-about-food-stamps-in-the-u-s/
That link argues against your claim.
In general, most Americans ages 16 to 59 who aren’t disabled must register with their state SNAP agency or employment office; meet any work, job search or job training requirements set by their state; accept a suitable job if one is offered to them; and work at least 30 hours a week. Failure to comply with those rules can disqualify people from getting SNAP benefits.
In addition, nondisabled adults without dependents must either work or participate in a work program for 80 hours a month, or participate in a state workfare program. If they fail to do so, they can only receive SNAP benefits for three months out of any 36-month period.
We have very few homeless people in Germany and we do have welfare. Where do you think the US failed?
Voting democrat, mostly
The actual answer is having a corrupt, monotone bipartisan system.
Thanks for your qualified and thoughtful insight /s
Reagan’s racist ghost, is that you? I haven’t heard a good “welfare queens” argument in a while.
You must be hanging out in the wrong places then
The problems you mentioned are created by the welfare system itself.
Welfare cliffs are what disincentivizes work. It’s not that “having welfare disincentivizes work”, its “getting a few more hours, or accepting a small promotion, makes them ineligible for thousands of dollars of benefits”.
It’s ‘throwing money at the problem’ doesn’t work. It never does.
Democrats only ever have one solution “throw money at it until it goes away”
It never does.
Did you miss up above where I asked you for a source for this?
This whole interaction is hilarious.
We did a study of what happens when you do X.
No, that’s wrong. X never works.
What is your study? Why do you say that? We did a study and it worked.
Because it is known. X never works.Honestly, I would be 100% open to it if you made some kind of argument for why some specific social program is actually making things worse when you study it, because I do think that happens. But, just falling back on thought-terminating cliches like “Welfare never works” and “Democrats only ever have one solution” and refusing to examine them further is not going to bring you any better ability to understand the world, and now you’re over here trying to export those malfunctioning thought patterns to other people, and surprise surprise, they’re not being friendly to your efforts.
What solutions do democrats have that don’t end up just as funding?
Nice deflection to a different topic. This whole story is about Canada, nothing about the US Democratic party. If for some reason you do want to talk about the effectiveness of “Democratic” fiscal policy versus “Republican” fiscal policy, I’m happy to do that.
Like I said, I’m actually fine having a good-faith discussion about either one of these topics if you’re into that, but if you’re just interested in tossing little one-sentence quips at me and ignoring relevant things I’m saying or questions that I’m asking, then IDK what the point would be. Surely you can see that, right?
I’ve read at least 8 of your posts on this topic. Not one time have you put out any ideas that you think would work. You keep saying that throwing money at it doesn’t work (without any citations) and that democrats are bad. Not once have you put out a different idea or said anything that WOULD help.
I can tell you from very personal experience that the welfare system does help people and makes lives better. You aren’t interested in that, though. You just have an agenda and will dismiss any story as an anecdote and will dismiss any study as biased or incomplete. You won’t actually link to anything that supports your position or even state a position outside of “welfare bad.”
What kind of source do you need? Welfare was created to get people on their feet and off of welfare, not for a quasi-UBI program that it’s turned into.
If welfare was working, you’d see less and less people receiving it. That’s not what’s happening though. There are more people on welfare now than there was 50 years ago.
The war on poverty has been a failure. Time for a new approach
Why would I put more than the minimal amount of effort into any post on lemmy, knowing that 100 communist teenagers are just going to reply “lol wrong, you fascist” and downvote?
If you want to debate me, I’d rather do that in real time on another program like discord. But lemmy is just a left wing commie shithole
Huh, I looked through your article. It didn’t mention anything about people staying on food stamps in order to not work. Given that grocery costs have sky rocketed in recent years, I hardly think that the $300 some odd makes people want to not work, especially coupled with the fact that non-disabled people are required to take any reasonable job and work 30 hours a week. Interesting source for your comment.
When has welfare ever made people richer?
Are you calling what’s being done in this story welfare? Because if so, I can cite this time.
Since always. Teaching man to fish is cheaper than providing fish for him every day or whatever they say.
Have you heard about this place called Europe? Look it up. And while you’re at it, look up how they handle policies related to financial equality while keeping high productivity and very prosperous societies.
We just prefer to give welfare to big oil and banks than to individuals.
Flips page… alright the next experiment for a potential solution is whipping anyone that misses a rent or mortgage payment, but also installing outdoor hot-tubs on streets.
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