ok sure, most servers are already running linux for a good reason.
As a student and programmer, I just installed debian few years ago and never thought about why I did that and why I haven’t returned to windows. For advance and light users linux is amazing with all these web based applications.
That’s a lawsuit waiting to happen.
No enterprise is going to want to deal with that and realistically they’re the only ones with the pockets to fight that battle. Hope I’m wrong though. Microsoft needs a swift kick in the ass.
If introducing Copilot to server degrades service enough to trigger an SLA upstream, you can absolutely bet lawyers will get involved.
If introducing Copilot to server degrades service enough to trigger an SLA downstream, you can absolutely bet lawyers will get involved.
There’s no need to degrade performance to get a lawsuit, the simple fact of extrading data can get you in a tribunal, especially from customers with high privacy requirements, or with European sovereign clouds certifications
Or if CoPilot starts exfiltrating data to Microsoft so their server farms can ‘analyze’ it.
I’m not heavily involved in the space, but I’m given to understand that MS isn’t very clear about what happens to your data or how it gets used or shared.
Perhaps Microsoft will be smart enough not to allow the general public to query trade secrets or government data that’s been pulled via unwanted copilot integration.
But maybe the ongoing Russian hack of Microsoft will make it irrelevant, because the servers can be accessed directly.
Or perhaps at some distant time, Microsoft will roll out features or technologies developed using an internal version of CoPilot that has access to all data - including proprietary information from competitors.And that’s not even counting what ISP’s will do if they find a way to analyze copilot traffic, or what state actors will do if they can set up MitM attacks for Copilot.
Honestly, I sort of fear the repercussions, but I look forward to the lawsuits.
I thought the Microsoft technologies designed to allow anyone to access your servers were called Exchange and Active Directory.
Please explain more.
I’m not confident they are authoritative on the matter.
Don’t consider me to be, either, but I have more details in my response to them.
I read their message as a joke that AD was an easy vector for an adversary
Usually those are the ones all those companies and organizations are using who have their files encrypted by malware.
Yes that’s because pretty much all companies use AD and exchange is also popular (but less so now with exchange online)
Both are also extremely valuable for companies and thus attackers.
Ransomware attacks pretty much always rely on missconfiguration and/or social engineering.
Correlation != Causation.
Now, on the other hand, the number of breaches has gone way up recently. Microsoft has pushed AD and Exchange into the cloud recently. And they just had several instances where keys were stolen and passwords were left in the clear for months after they were notified, as well…
Well we have no solid evidence but it’s certainly within the realm of possibility.
Exchange allows users to access data and Microsoft services and it comes with good documentation and a whole slew of controls for org admins.
Active Directory provides authentication services, and it is mostly for your internal users (so they can access org services, including Exchange), but it’s very common to allow guests and to federate under certain circumstances, so your AD talks to their AD and external guests can authenticate and use resources that have been shared with them.
It is also well-documented with tight control in the hands of administrators.Copilot is a black box. Their terms of service are vague. Microsoft’s responsible AI website comprises of marketing speak, no details, and the standards guide on the site is mostly questions that amount to “TBD”. Administrative ability to control data sharing is non-existent, not yet developed, or minimal.
We don’t know the scope of data gathered, the retention and handling policies, or where that data/any models built from that data are going to wind up.
My read is that they’re waiting to be sued or legislated before they impose any limits on themselves.
If introducing Copilot to server degrades service enough to trigger an SLA upstream, you can absolutely bet lawyers will get involved.
Fuck I just set up a Windows Server 2022, because Space Engineers Dedicated Server is officially supported under Windows only.
You could try running it in wine
It installed itself on my laptop during the last update. Anyone know how to remove it? Will uninstall actually get rid of it?
In the EU you can just uninstall it.
I don’t have a Windows 11 machine available, so I can’t get you the exact command, but this should get you there.
It should remove it from all users on the laptop, and (hopefully!) prevent it from coming back:Open Powershell and run:
Get-AppxProvisionedPackage -Online | Where-Object {$_.displayname -like "*Copilot*"}Copy the Package Name entry and run the following command, with PACKAGENAME replaced by what you just copied:
Remove-AppxProvisionedPackage -online -packagename PACKAGENAMETry asking it. 😆
Will uninstall actually get rid of it?
maybe for a couple months
Microsoft has a whole suite of exfiltration tools such as telemetry and searchapp. Check out what searchapp does next time you search for anything. Those searches are going to microsoft online services, what about thr index?. So youve reached the tip of the of the spyware operating system.
This is going to end very well :P
What the hell?!?!?! This is a server OS! It needs to be as light as possible and for the sake of server stability and security, admins carefully choose the installed apps. Microsoft can just install new applications on a whim.
This is fuged up.
People in this thread seem to be missing this point.
This is windows server, not windows 11. The consequences is not “I’ll have an annoying taskbar icon on my home computer”, this is enterprise level interference that could affect large systems and thousands of users.
Linux Mint isn’t an alternative to windows server.
You’re right ig, in that case grab Debian.
I only SysAdmin on raspbian thank you very much.
Freebsd letsgo
You could install Rocky and be done
Yep. I no longer have to administer Windows servers (everything I do is serverless these days) but I did for many years.
Adding anything to a server without vetting it against policies is a huge no no. Back when I was doing it, a big part of our monthly update deployment was updating the test environment first so we knew we weren’t about to break a bunch of shit for us and our customers. Not just “does this brick Windows server”, but “do our applications still function” (usually yes, but the answer was no on several occasions over shit smaller than this).
I don’t know what adding copilot does. Is it going to accidentally break some custom application by accident because it’s tied directly into the system? Is it going to report shit that I’ve already opted out of due to our data policies and possibly fuck up our audit compliance because of government regulations (defense, medical, and energy sectors have huge responsibilities in that area, just don’t ask how I know)? How does it interact with our in-house developed software?
Fuck, I dunno. That sounds like a nightmare for infrastructure and ops, several managers, government regulators, and a payday for legal.
The thought of administering windows server is vomitous.
Maybe, but it’s still widely used and someone has to do it.
How else would you manage microsoft AD?
There’s alternatives out there, unless you have specific contract obligations.
Yeah but Fedora and Debian sure as shit are.
For sure, if you need paid support (which if you aren’t a tech giant, a fledgling startup, or a system with no need for uptime metrics, you probally do) the you have:
- SUSE Linux Enterprise Server (aka SLES and only still Libre option in this category unfortunately)
- Red Hat Enterprise Linux (RHEL)
- Ubuntu are
if don’t need paid support then Debian, OpenSuse, Rocky, or Fedora are all good picks.
Almost any Unix can be an alternative for Windows Server. Never understood why it was used, other than tech illiteracy of lowly tech workers who only knew MS stack.
The usual answer to that is “active directory”. It’s not uncommon to have one windows server alongside other Linux servers because of AD.
In addition, with all Microsoft’s faults they had a hell of a small business package for years. In a lot of small businesses, the current CIO came up during those times and dictates policy.
Plus there are a lot of VARs and MSPs who push MS due to favorable terms and kickbacks. Small and medium sized businesses who outsource IT go with whatever they’re told because they don’t have the expertise, time, or desire to explore alternatives.
Plus there’s a load of self hosted software for certain industries that only works on Windows servers.
That’s all true for consumer OS as well
Stop resisting!!
Oh they can, as we see
I am jack’s complete pikachu face
Why is anyone surprised by this??!
There is a truly baffling amount of people who imagine that Microsoft has suddenly turned into a good company.
Great
Can anyone backup this claim?
gotta use a superior os https://devuan.org
^ Calls on someone for not using the superior OS // Proceeds to point people to a pointless, barely maintained and buggy fork of Debian. lol
bruh, idk why i’m getting downvoted to hell but it’s the exact opposite of a pointless unmaintained buggy fork lol.
yeah it’s superior since systemd is inferior if you don’t exactly need it
I was about to tell you that when I made the post I was more joking about it than actually being serious… but then after your systemd comment…
SystemD-less Debian lol what year is this.
Went to their site to see the pitch. “avoiding unnecessary entanglements” lmao this fuckin distro is trying to prevent WWI
We just saw an attempted hack from having the xz library loaded into OpenSSH via libsystemd. Linux kernel and glibc are large enough without adding yet another thing that’s contrary to the Unix philosophy.
I still have systemd on my distro because that isn’t my top priority. I respect the efforts of everyone trying to keep it out and wish them success. Same with every distro trying to use musl.
I completely agree, but I do find the anti-systemd crowd to be more annoying than helpful in most contexts.
Why does every mention or discussion of any annoyance in Windows immediately turn into a “install Linux” thread on here?
Sure, Linux might solve the immediate problem for the affected individual (and probably introduce a bunch of new ones as Linux isn’t always as easy to use as advocates try to convince people it is) but it doesn’t solve the larger issue - Microsoft needs to be held accountable for horrible design decisions and anti-consumerist practices.
Not everyone can, or will, switch to Linux. No matter how hard people champion that cause. And even if they do, it’s a process that will take time. In the immediate, lots of people stand to benefit from Microsoft not pulling this sort of bs, and it’s entirely justified to complain about it to make them walk back this decision.
People moving away from Microsoft is literally how Microsoft will be held accountable though
Once again people forget “vote with your wallet”.
CaNceL cUlTuRe!!
I think it’s safe to say that the Lemmy user base trends a bit more “computer nerd” than the general public. So we generally have more people that already use Linux, and more people that could reasonably benefit from switching.
Plus of course moving off of windows is one of the most effective ways to show your displeasure with Microsoft.
All these discussions turn into that because WE KNOW that no one will convince MS to stop doing whatever they want, specially after investing literally billions on this kind of technology, the idea of MS “being held accountable” is something that realistically will not happen, and literally the only leverage people have against them is to just stop playing their game. Oh yeah, it’s not easy, but given the fact that MS have made it so that you’ll HAVE to fight the tech and relearn stuff every time they unilaterally decide to change things you might as well put effort where it will make a difference and free you from their BS
You’re not wrong, but as privacy conscious consumers we have more ways to force Microsoft and other tech giants to bend the knee than just disengaging with their product and leaving less savvy users to fend for themselves. One such example is legislative action, take a look at how the EU has been wielding their internal market to force companies into more pro-consumer practices. Another is class action lawsuits, there’s a long history of successful suits resulting in lasting change.
You might not agree with me on whether those options are the right path forward here, but I feel that we, as security and privacy conscious owners have a duty to speak up about these things for the majority that can’t or won’t due to their technical abilities.
But it’s only 8KB.
I can’t believe people use this shit.
I can’t believe people use this shit.
What’s your suggestion for a HIPAA validated EHR or PM system that runs on *Nix or WS without DE installed? Do you have one?
I think you responded to the wrong comment.
Anyway, if you need it to run on a server, I don’t see why you’d need a DE. If you’re talking about the client, I don’t see why you’d need to run it on a server OS without a DE.
Its cloud based, great
Thats a load of bullshit. The icon is probably more than that.
My comment was sarcastic, but I guess I need to start using /s here as on reddit.
If you have to use Windows Server (or other Windows), install the hellzerg Optimizer
Who exactly is the target audience for this? Home users running Windows server? This would get flagged for sure in an enterprise environment and no self respecting admin would ever install something like that.
Unfortunately these services also open up security issues
Yes I think the better solution is to read your username. It’s hard to argue with Linux and BSDs when it comes to servers.
I agree 100%. Google Cloud platform doesn’t have Windows servers and the cloud providers are simply two small for Microsoft products.
Its hard to beat a Linux server as you can spin one up on prem or in the cloud quickly and it doesn’t have a lot of overhead in most cases.
When the switch to run it on a server is “/unsafe” I think I’ll pass 🤣
Anyway on Windows the Optimizer is an must have app. It is the best to cut M$'s bad habits
Yeeeeah, no enterprise admin would run that… GPOs would do the same with more transparency and no privacy concerns (besides running Windows of course)
You will become AI
Use BSD/Linux/Ironclad/SmartOS etc etc Open source Operating systems for
Samba AD DC
Anyone who cares about this and doesn’t require a Windows server is already using BSD/Linux/etc
Get rid of that crap, I and I’m not talking about Copilot.
