I’m not from the US and I’d say both are pretty bad. US democracy seems to be in shambles and their interference around the world is well known. China democracy is non existent and the treatment of their own citizens is questionable.
China practices democracy a little bit differently, and I’d argue more democratically.
Instead of fighting over candidates in a show fight where you don’t get a say in policy, China operates under democratic centralism where you come to a consensus on actual policy. As for treatment of their own citizens, the Chinese government has been making strides to improve the lives of their average citizen, and this does show in statistics.
I know I’m in the wrong community for this but I’m interested in your take. I thought China was an authoritarian one-party state. To be a democracy don’t the people need to be able to vote for their elected officials? I see China as democratic as Russia in that sense, with a single party being kept in power for decades with the intent of eternity.
Others have commented here telling you more about China’s system (technically not a one party state, though CPC rule is constitutionally protected; Russia also has multiple parties).
I encourage you to continue interrogating your own understanding of democracy beyond what the US insists democracy is. Is it democratic to allow voting in a system that only has real room for two corrupt bourgeois parties that only serve the billionaire class while its citizens have no functional say in the matters that actual affect them? What about all of the people living in the vassal states and colonies of US empire? Do they get a vote? Does it make sense for the “leader of the free world” to have the largest prison population in the entire world, a heavily racialized one at that? How can you honestly and confidentially claim that the US is democratic when you look beyond the theatre that happens every 4 years? (I’m not saying you’re claiming this, I’m just confronting you with the question).
What about the Nordic-model countries that the Western left loves to point to as “democratic socialism”? They have multiple parties, even explicitly fascist/white nationalist parties that participate in the legislature. Is it democratic to allow explicitly fascist political forces a say in the political system? Is it democratic for Nordic countires to support their welfare states using the spoils of imperialism while the US, Britain and France do the dirty work of military occupations and regime change operations?
Going back to the US, do you think the founding fathers would have allowed a monarchist party a say when establishing the the expectations of the liberal democratic system? Of course not. If we are to understand socialism as a progressive economic system that will supplant capitalism, then why should China, a socialist country, allow a liberal capitalist party a say in their politics either?
To the answer of your “is it democratic to allow X”, well yes. Isn’t that the point of democracy? To give power to the people. I don’t think any state truly does that. They all want to hold power and power stays with a few selected rather than truly “the people”. Some states give the illusion of democracy, with power flipping between multiple parties with largely similar goals and aspirations. Rather some buck that trend and just say 100% voted on Y.
But to your answer of “is it democratic”? Yes. A truly democractic society should welcome any political ideology, regardless of the incumbants current ideology. If a party had enough popularity and votes to change the political system, then so be it.
I’m not American, and I’m as ignorant to American politics as to Chinese, so I dunno what the founding fathers would of wanted. Maybe I can read about that another day. Thanks for your input.
A truly democractic society should welcome any political ideology, regardless of the incumbants current ideology.
Any political ideology opens a can of worms.
The “liberal democratic” country of Obristan has two ethnic groups: the Korai (70% of population) and the Mirai (30% of population). The Korai get together and form the Satsujin Party, whose ideology is simple: to kill all Mirai.
Is the society still a democratic society if the Satsujin Party gains a majority and passes laws ordering execution of all the Mirai? Is that society in the interests of all its people? Surely, we can understand that any reasonable society cannot allow the Satsujin Party’s ideology.
some buck that trend and just say 100% voted on Y.
I’d encourage you to read on democratic centralism. The idea is that instead of engaging in dramatic political stunts, we could have a genuine effort on all sides to listen to the differing perspectives, try to come up with the best solution, and then agree together on that best solution. That sure sounds like what democracy is supposed to be in my opinion.
I’m sorry if it came off like I was just assuming you were American. That wasn’t my intention. I use America as the example because America is the major upholder of the imperialist system and Western democracies are inspired by the American model, so I assumed it’d likely be familiar.
I thought China was an authoritarian one-party state. To be a democracy don’t the people need to be able to vote for their elected officials? I see China as democratic as Russia in that sense, with a single party being kept in power for decades with the intent of eternity.
China is a democracy, they vote for represnatives, they then vote for policy.
Its a one party state, sure; the people vote for that every year.
America is also a one ideological state too, need I remind you communists are banned in the US and the red scare was literally the american state deporting people for even being suspected of being communist.
Only having one ideology isnt a unique feature of chinese democracy; its the reality in most neo-liberal democracies too.
Sure, in some countries in neo-liberal systems do they tolerate socialists or other ideologies, but name one time this has succeeded in beating a neo-liberal party; neo-liberal countries have dominated every aparatus of society, through the media to education, the odds are so heavily stacked in there favour that it is in practice one party.
The comment about US banning communism seems out of place, however thank you for this. This got me reading about Chinas elections. It seems like their elections have been one-sides for decades you start to think whats the point? But if a system works for them, right?
The comment about US banning communism seems out of place,
I do it to point out western hypocrasy that is often leveled at China, they criticize it for being a dictatorship that bans other parties while existing in countries that routinely round up, deport and execute socialists.
To understand Chinese democracy you need to understand that genuinally most people in China support the government.
The reason as to why is nuanced, but most of them didnt even have electricty in the 80s, now they are the 2nd biggest global superpower, have instant access to healthcare and 90% of them own a house with modern furnishings; quite simply the communist party have completely transformed China in most peoples lifetimes, they enjoy complete popular support for the most part.
I’m not from the US and I’d say both are pretty bad. US democracy seems to be in shambles and their interference around the world is well known. China democracy is non existent and the treatment of their own citizens is questionable.
China practices democracy a little bit differently, and I’d argue more democratically.
Instead of fighting over candidates in a show fight where you don’t get a say in policy, China operates under democratic centralism where you come to a consensus on actual policy. As for treatment of their own citizens, the Chinese government has been making strides to improve the lives of their average citizen, and this does show in statistics.
I know I’m in the wrong community for this but I’m interested in your take. I thought China was an authoritarian one-party state. To be a democracy don’t the people need to be able to vote for their elected officials? I see China as democratic as Russia in that sense, with a single party being kept in power for decades with the intent of eternity.
Others have commented here telling you more about China’s system (technically not a one party state, though CPC rule is constitutionally protected; Russia also has multiple parties).
I encourage you to continue interrogating your own understanding of democracy beyond what the US insists democracy is. Is it democratic to allow voting in a system that only has real room for two corrupt bourgeois parties that only serve the billionaire class while its citizens have no functional say in the matters that actual affect them? What about all of the people living in the vassal states and colonies of US empire? Do they get a vote? Does it make sense for the “leader of the free world” to have the largest prison population in the entire world, a heavily racialized one at that? How can you honestly and confidentially claim that the US is democratic when you look beyond the theatre that happens every 4 years? (I’m not saying you’re claiming this, I’m just confronting you with the question).
What about the Nordic-model countries that the Western left loves to point to as “democratic socialism”? They have multiple parties, even explicitly fascist/white nationalist parties that participate in the legislature. Is it democratic to allow explicitly fascist political forces a say in the political system? Is it democratic for Nordic countires to support their welfare states using the spoils of imperialism while the US, Britain and France do the dirty work of military occupations and regime change operations?
Going back to the US, do you think the founding fathers would have allowed a monarchist party a say when establishing the the expectations of the liberal democratic system? Of course not. If we are to understand socialism as a progressive economic system that will supplant capitalism, then why should China, a socialist country, allow a liberal capitalist party a say in their politics either?
To the answer of your “is it democratic to allow X”, well yes. Isn’t that the point of democracy? To give power to the people. I don’t think any state truly does that. They all want to hold power and power stays with a few selected rather than truly “the people”. Some states give the illusion of democracy, with power flipping between multiple parties with largely similar goals and aspirations. Rather some buck that trend and just say 100% voted on Y.
But to your answer of “is it democratic”? Yes. A truly democractic society should welcome any political ideology, regardless of the incumbants current ideology. If a party had enough popularity and votes to change the political system, then so be it.
I’m not American, and I’m as ignorant to American politics as to Chinese, so I dunno what the founding fathers would of wanted. Maybe I can read about that another day. Thanks for your input.
Any political ideology opens a can of worms.
The “liberal democratic” country of Obristan has two ethnic groups: the Korai (70% of population) and the Mirai (30% of population). The Korai get together and form the Satsujin Party, whose ideology is simple: to kill all Mirai.
Is the society still a democratic society if the Satsujin Party gains a majority and passes laws ordering execution of all the Mirai? Is that society in the interests of all its people? Surely, we can understand that any reasonable society cannot allow the Satsujin Party’s ideology.
I’d encourage you to read on democratic centralism. The idea is that instead of engaging in dramatic political stunts, we could have a genuine effort on all sides to listen to the differing perspectives, try to come up with the best solution, and then agree together on that best solution. That sure sounds like what democracy is supposed to be in my opinion.
I’m sorry if it came off like I was just assuming you were American. That wasn’t my intention. I use America as the example because America is the major upholder of the imperialist system and Western democracies are inspired by the American model, so I assumed it’d likely be familiar.
Both China and the DPRK are led by popular fronts: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_political_parties_in_North_Korea https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_political_parties_in_China
Cuba, Vietnam and Laos are one-party Marxist-Leninist states.
China is a democracy, they vote for represnatives, they then vote for policy. Its a one party state, sure; the people vote for that every year. America is also a one ideological state too, need I remind you communists are banned in the US and the red scare was literally the american state deporting people for even being suspected of being communist.
Only having one ideology isnt a unique feature of chinese democracy; its the reality in most neo-liberal democracies too.
Sure, in some countries in neo-liberal systems do they tolerate socialists or other ideologies, but name one time this has succeeded in beating a neo-liberal party; neo-liberal countries have dominated every aparatus of society, through the media to education, the odds are so heavily stacked in there favour that it is in practice one party.
The comment about US banning communism seems out of place, however thank you for this. This got me reading about Chinas elections. It seems like their elections have been one-sides for decades you start to think whats the point? But if a system works for them, right?
I do it to point out western hypocrasy that is often leveled at China, they criticize it for being a dictatorship that bans other parties while existing in countries that routinely round up, deport and execute socialists.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Hampton#Raid
To understand Chinese democracy you need to understand that genuinally most people in China support the government. The reason as to why is nuanced, but most of them didnt even have electricty in the 80s, now they are the 2nd biggest global superpower, have instant access to healthcare and 90% of them own a house with modern furnishings; quite simply the communist party have completely transformed China in most peoples lifetimes, they enjoy complete popular support for the most part.