Both the president and his reelection campaign are going after his coup-attempting predecessor even before the first GOP primary ballots are cast.

A full year out from the 2024 presidential election and nearly two months before Republicans cast their first primary ballots, President Joe Biden and his campaign are assuming that Donald Trump will be his opponent and have already started reminding voters why they threw him out of office in the first place.

Biden personally has stepped up criticism of his coup-attempting predecessor and is framing the likely rematch as one that will determine the survival of American democracy.

“The same man who said we should terminate the rules and regulations and articles of the Constitution — these are things he said — is now running on a plan to end democracy as we know it,” he said last week at a fundraiser in Chicago.

“This next election is different. It’s more important. There’s more at stake. And we all know why: Because our very democracy is at stake,” he told a San Francisco audience on Wednesday.

  • queermunist she/her@lemmy.ml
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    28
    arrow-down
    130
    ·
    edit-2
    1 year ago

    I voted for Biden because I wanted to stop fascism and world war, now Israel is doing genocide and bombing its neighbors with Biden’s tacit support.

    • 𝕱𝖎𝖗𝖊𝖜𝖎𝖙𝖈𝖍@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      35
      arrow-down
      5
      ·
      edit-2
      1 year ago

      So instead you’ll either do nothing to stop- or even worse, actively vote for the guy who thinks we aren’t doing enough to support genocide? The guy whose party is actively trying to expel Palestinians from the US? The guy who has openly promised to bring about full force fascism and end democracy?

      Cool cool cool

        • Xtallll@lemmy.blahaj.zone
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          9
          arrow-down
          2
          ·
          1 year ago

          Not how the US Constitution is written, want better choices, vote in the primaries, or push for your state to implement a Ranked Choice Vote. Otherwise you only get two choices on the second Tuesday in November, A or B.

          • Bartsbigbugbag@lemmy.ml
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            3
            ·
            1 year ago

            Or, accept that constitutions can be changed, and even replaced. It’s happening in countries right now, actually. Our constitution is out of date, and inherently reflects the white supremacist Eurocentric view of its writers. It’s far past time to retire it and replace it with one that enshrines Justice for all, including environmental Justice.

            • AutVincamAutPeriam@lemmy.zip
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              2
              arrow-down
              1
              ·
              1 year ago

              I agree with you. This is a progressive ideal. The way to get there is to vote for the most progressive candidates that can actually win and deliver them the Congress and Senate multiple terms so that we cannot be held back by regressives.

              See you at the polls!

              • Bartsbigbugbag@lemmy.ml
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                1
                ·
                1 year ago

                What avenue is in place for replacing the constitution through the current system? As far as I am aware, there isn’t one, and it will have to be done outside of the system through direct action forcing change. In the streets, not in the ballot boxes.

                • AutVincamAutPeriam@lemmy.zip
                  link
                  fedilink
                  arrow-up
                  3
                  ·
                  1 year ago

                  “The founders also specified a process by which the Constitution may be amended, and since its ratification, the Constitution has been amended 27 times. In order to prevent arbitrary changes, the process for making amendments is quite onerous. An amendment may be proposed by a two-thirds vote of both Houses of Congress, or, if two-thirds of the States request one, by a convention called for that purpose. The amendment must then be ratified by three-fourths of the State legislatures, or three-fourths of conventions called in each State for ratification.” - Whitehouse.gov

                  This is the way.

                  • Bartsbigbugbag@lemmy.ml
                    link
                    fedilink
                    arrow-up
                    2
                    ·
                    1 year ago

                    Amendments don’t address the inherently white supremacist nature of the constitution, but amending it would be a step in the right direction.

                    We can start by removing MEN from the preamble and replacing it with PEOPLE, but literally every single part of it needs adjustments to remove the settler mind rot.

          • Bartsbigbugbag@lemmy.ml
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            1
            arrow-down
            3
            ·
            1 year ago

            It’s been shown using decades of analysis that voting for the lesser evil ALWAYS moves you to the right. We will not vote our way out of this. If Biden gets into office again, he will fulfill his purpose as the political ratchet, preventing leftward movement. Just as he has done now, with his refusal to pick postal governors who will get rid of the definitively election tampering DeJoy. Just as he’s done with his record police funding. Just as he’s done with his ceaseless support of genocide in Palestine. Just as he’s done with his action preventing rail workers from ever again having the right to strike( and don’t hit me with that, they got 4 days of sick time, that’s totally a victory, because it’s not.). Just as he’s done with his refusal to even make a statement on cop city. Just like he’s doing by directing his DOJ to suppress pro-Palestinian protestors in universities and cities.

            If you want change, stop acquiescing to their system, and demand it. Change happens in the streets, not the ballot boxes. Vote for harm reduction, I will, but make no illusions about it, you are not in any way making things better, that work is done not by voting, but by acting collectively.

            • AutVincamAutPeriam@lemmy.zip
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              2
              arrow-down
              1
              ·
              1 year ago

              I quickly scanned over this after I saw the words “Decades of analysis.” [Citation needed.]

              I will not be reading the rest unless I see a citation for this authoritative abstract you’ve written.

              • Bartsbigbugbag@lemmy.ml
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                2
                ·
                edit-2
                1 year ago

                Do you have a researchgate or JSTOR account? It’s not gonna do any good to link you if you can’t read it, because in th is society academic information is locked behind paywalls unfortunately.

                • AutVincamAutPeriam@lemmy.zip
                  link
                  fedilink
                  arrow-up
                  1
                  ·
                  edit-2
                  1 year ago

                  Forgive me if I’m not willing to accept an authoritative statement based on data without access to the data. But I’m not willing to take that leap.

                  The problem, as I see it, is we live in a flawed democracy and the path to change by definition lies with getting the most progressive candidates possible in office unimpeded by regressives. It’s the only reasonable way to get change. It will be slow, it will not always be exciting. But in the meantime, I have to put food on the table and manage my life, so taking to the streets is not a reasonable long term solution for me.

                  I’ll continue donating to progressive causes, voting, and arguing online. It’s the bandwidth I can spare.

                  I suspect we agree more than we disagree and our differences are a matter of degrees.

                  • Bartsbigbugbag@lemmy.ml
                    link
                    fedilink
                    arrow-up
                    2
                    ·
                    1 year ago

                    My issue with that, is change has historically happened in this country not through the ballot box, but the soap box. We didn’t vote pro union politicians into office, we literally fought and died by the hundreds against the government and companies until union rights were enshrined into law. We didn’t vote pro-civil rights politicians into office, we rioted in the streets in what was called the “Long Hot Summer”. You know? Like I said, I’ll vote for damage control, but I have no illusions that it will effect change in any of the many ways we need radical change. That will come from the bottom up, not the top down. We will force politicians to do what we will, and since we have NO methods for redressal of grievance through the system (no, someone serving their full term and possibly not getting re-elected is not redressal of grievance), we have to do so outside of the system, through direct action.

                    Thankfully, we’re seeing that now. People are doing the right things now, like interrupting politicians at dinners and events, and blockading imperialist corporations and preventing movement of weaponry, and sabotaging facilities to prevent their use by the state for oppressive purposes. Make their lives impossible. Make them live in fear of what will happen to them if they reject the will of the voters more than they fear what will happen if they reject the will of their donors.

                    That’s what wins fights, not saying, “I am gonna vote blue no matter who”, which immediately tells them they have no incentive to change because you’ll vote for them no matter what.

    • Decoy321@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      28
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      edit-2
      1 year ago

      Suuuure, buddy. Because the alternative would be SO much better. Have you forgotten the many, many times Trump explicity showed support for Netanhayu?

      • queermunist she/her@lemmy.ml
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        1
        arrow-down
        36
        ·
        1 year ago

        Have you forgotten how much Democrats hate Trump?

        Under Biden, Democrats are all lining up to support Israel’s genocide in Gaza. Even Bernie refuses to endorse a ceasefire.

        Under Trump that would be drastically different. I bet more than half of Democrats would have the courage to condemn Israel.

        • oatscoop@midwest.social
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          13
          arrow-down
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          “It’ll be better under Trump!”

          … I’m seriously starting to think some of these lemmy.ml and hexbear “communist” are MAGAts cosplaying Marxists.

          • PugJesus@kbin.social
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            6
            ·
            1 year ago

            They’re similar in that they have horrendously naive and simplistic views of the world. Mirror images.

          • queermunist she/her@lemmy.ml
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            3
            arrow-down
            16
            ·
            1 year ago

            I didn’t say it would be better, I said Democrats would have better political positions.

            Do you think Bernie would refuse to endorse a ceasefire under Trump?

            • PugJesus@kbin.social
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              7
              arrow-down
              2
              ·
              1 year ago

              Do you think Bernie would refuse to endorse a ceasefire under Trump?

              Yes, probably. Considering that it comes on the heels of an attack that killed a thousand Israeli civilians, and Bibi has made it clear that a ceasefire is not going to happen?

              “Politics is the art of the possible, the attainable - the art of the second best.”

                • PugJesus@kbin.social
                  link
                  fedilink
                  arrow-up
                  13
                  arrow-down
                  1
                  ·
                  1 year ago

                  You keep living in your land of imagination, then, where everything will get better once it gets worse, like some kind of pendulum. Those of us who understand that we aren’t living in a fairy-tale world will continue to actually work to stop fascism.

          • queermunist she/her@lemmy.ml
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            3
            arrow-down
            21
            ·
            1 year ago

            Care to explain further? Because his entire term during presidency says otherwise.

            Do you remember when Democrats opposed Trump moving the embassy to Jerusalem?

            I’m not saying Trump wouldn’t support Israel. He absolutely would! But Democrats would react to this by becoming less supportive of Israel.

            At the very least politicians like Bernie would have the courage to call for a ceasefire.

            • AbidanYre@lemmy.world
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              10
              arrow-down
              1
              ·
              edit-2
              1 year ago

              I remember when Trump became president and suddenly Republicans were strongly in support of bombing Syria but Democrat opinion stayed roughly where it was. So, basically your entire premise is flawed.

                • PugJesus@kbin.social
                  link
                  fedilink
                  arrow-up
                  6
                  arrow-down
                  1
                  ·
                  1 year ago

                  In a two-party system, not voting is a vote for the eventual winner. So you’re still voting for genocide.

                  But this time it’ll be with Trump, and so without calls for a ‘humanitarian pause’ (which is a call for a ceasefire in terms that save face for Bibi’s government, which has clearly signaled that it will not consider a ceasefire). Instead, rather, it’d probably be accompanied by horrendously racist rhetoric encouraging the rise in domestic Islamophobic attacks. I wouldn’t be surprised if US jets were running sorties on Palestinian hospitals if this happened under a Trump presidency.

      • queermunist she/her@lemmy.ml
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        2
        arrow-down
        45
        ·
        edit-2
        1 year ago

        No. Lose/lose situation no matter who wins.

        But! Do you think Democrats would support Israel’s genocide if Trump was president? I doubt it.

        • PugJesus@kbin.social
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          24
          arrow-down
          2
          ·
          1 year ago

          But! Do you think Democrats would support Israel’s genocide if Trump was president? I doubt it.

          What the fuck do you think the Dems have been doing since the 80s? Through every Republican presidency?

            • PugJesus@kbin.social
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              23
              arrow-down
              1
              ·
              1 year ago

              Yes, and so were the GOP before Trump. That’s not a “Well, the Dems decided to oppose the move because it was a Republican president!” moment, it’s a “The Dems are the conservative party and the GOP is the fascist party” moment.

              • queermunist she/her@lemmy.ml
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                3
                arrow-down
                21
                ·
                1 year ago

                That’s why the best move is for Democrats to control the House and Senate, and that’s why I’m voting down ticket for Democrats.

                I don’t care about why Democrats oppose Trump, I just know that they will. Or do you think that Bernie Sanders would refuse to call for a ceasefire if Trump was President, like what he’s doing right now under Biden?

                • PugJesus@kbin.social
                  link
                  fedilink
                  arrow-up
                  8
                  arrow-down
                  1
                  ·
                  1 year ago

                  I don’t care about why Democrats oppose Trump, I just know that they will.

                  “This is the history of the matter. That’s literally not how it works, and you’re confusing the opposition of one policy with some idea of complete contrarianism that flies in the face of how the Democratic Party has operated, not only over the past 30 years in general, but also under Trump in particular.”

                  “I don’t know WHY they’ll do it, but they WILL”

                  Okay, buddy, have fun with that.

                  • queermunist she/her@lemmy.ml
                    link
                    fedilink
                    arrow-up
                    1
                    arrow-down
                    16
                    ·
                    1 year ago

                    Opposition to one policy is more than opposition to literally nothing.

                    All I know is the norms went out the window under Trump. I’m willing to bet it’ll be even worse in his second term and Democrats will revolt.

    • MisterHavoc@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      20
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      Would it be any different if it was any other president? Put differently, is it Biden supporting genocide, or America?

      • MisterHavoc@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        10
        arrow-down
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        Which, don’t get me wrong. Fuck Biden, America whoever for doing nothing about it. My question is the validity of punishing Biden, by saying I won’t vote for him, il vote for x, as if x would have done it any differently. The only benefit x has is he wasn’t in charge while happening. So being punitive vs Biden is pointless.

      • queermunist she/her@lemmy.ml
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        1
        arrow-down
        4
        ·
        1 year ago

        Most Americans support a ceasefire, so it’s not really “America” either. It’s the ruling class.

        But Biden has a lot of power all on his own. We can’t ignore that.

    • BigMacHole@lemm.ee
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      17
      arrow-down
      2
      ·
      1 year ago

      Don’t forget that Democrats for the most part have to listen to their voters or risk their jobs. Republicans don’t have to listen to anyone because Republican voters would literally vote for Hitler if he had an R next to his name. There’s been a slow trickle of headlines about Biden changing his tune on Israel as slow as a geriatric can go because of the immense outrage.

    • LillyPip@lemmy.ca
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      13
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      Biden is president of the US, not the world. He has little more ability to stop the latest flare up of that decades long conflict than does Trudeau or any other nation’s leader.

      What do you expect him to do about it that he isn’t already doing?

      • SheeEttin@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        6
        arrow-down
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        Stopping aid to Israel would be a start. Sanctions would be good. Getting the world community together to force Israel to stop if they don’t would be great.

        • LillyPip@lemmy.ca
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          10
          arrow-down
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          Talk to Congress about that.

          Biden has been working the diplomacy angle, but diplomacy is like herding cats.

          The US president is not a dictator, and should not be. If you want actual progress, stop electing frauds, criminals, and children to Congress.

      • queermunist she/her@lemmy.ml
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        5
        arrow-down
        14
        ·
        edit-2
        1 year ago

        Israel is wholly dependent on the US to be able to act with impunity in the region.

        If Biden said “no ceasefire, no warships” and threatened to pull out of the Gulf and not defend Israel you bet your ass Israel would fall in line.

        • LillyPip@lemmy.ca
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          8
          arrow-down
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          Hard disagree.

          If it were that easy, why hasn’t the US put this to bed over the many decades this situation has been going on in that region?

          If your solution can be stated in one sentence, I promise it’s too myopic to work. The situation there is massively complex, and every easy solution has been tried at least once.

          • CmdrShepard@lemmy.one
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            3
            arrow-down
            1
            ·
            1 year ago

            They’re talking about a ceasefire while you’re talking about longterm peace in the region. You’re not even arguing about the same thing.

          • queermunist she/her@lemmy.ml
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            1
            arrow-down
            14
            ·
            edit-2
            1 year ago

            The US hasn’t put this to bed because it needs Israel to maintain its global empire, so Israel is allowed to do whatever it wants as long as it serves US interests. Israel is the US’s unsinkable aircraft carrier in the middle east. Israel is a keystone of power projection and regional influence. Israel is the laboratory for surveillance tech, drone tech, boarder tech, occupation tech, and policing tech. Israel is America’s most precious and most important ally, probably in the entire world. As Biden said, if Israel didn’t exist the US would have to make it.

            Biden supports the US empire so he isn’t going to cut Israel off, same as every single president before him.

            But that doesn’t mean I’m wrong, and honestly, just proves that the US empire needs to be dismantled.

    • Snot Flickerman@lemmy.blahaj.zone
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      7
      arrow-down
      20
      ·
      edit-2
      1 year ago

      They don’t actually want Trump behind bars.

      They want to hang a possible second Trump Presidency over us like the sword of Damocles.

      This way every future election is “the most important election in US history.”

      This way they can always do bare minimum and still be “better” than the Republicans offering hate and authoritarianism.

      • cannache@slrpnk.net
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        2
        ·
        1 year ago

        No I don’t think of it as the sword of Damocles so much as, look here’s this guy that will do anything you want but will go to extreme lengths to get it done, in ways that may go against your original values, now maybe you should consider having a plan as much as you think about being results oriented

          • CmdrShepard@lemmy.one
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            4
            arrow-down
            18
            ·
            1 year ago

            That’s like saying “if you hadn’t burned dinner, your husband wouldn’t have had a reason to beat you.”

            Absolutely disgusting viewpoint.

          • queermunist she/her@lemmy.ml
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            4
            arrow-down
            24
            ·
            1 year ago

            No, Biden is to blame for ignoring the extremely loud demands from the Dem base for a ceasefire. No ceasefire, no votes.

            Also? This is why liberals will support Trump when he restarts the Muslim bans. “They let Trump win! It’ll serve them right.” 🙄

            • Flying Squid@lemmy.world
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              16
              arrow-down
              1
              ·
              1 year ago

              I’m pretty sure whoever loses an election can rightfully blame the people who didn’t vote for them. That’s sort of how elections work.

              • queermunist she/her@lemmy.ml
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                4
                arrow-down
                18
                ·
                1 year ago

                I will rightfully blame Biden for being a bad candidate and blame the Democratic Party for forcing Biden down our throats and making voters choose between Trump and Biden. That’s also how elections work.

                • Flying Squid@lemmy.world
                  link
                  fedilink
                  arrow-up
                  13
                  arrow-down
                  1
                  ·
                  1 year ago

                  Okay? But that still means that he can’t rightfully blame you for not voting for him if he loses. Despite what you said.

                  • queermunist she/her@lemmy.ml
                    link
                    fedilink
                    arrow-up
                    3
                    arrow-down
                    15
                    ·
                    1 year ago

                    He can’t blame me for being unwilling to vote for genocide! He can blame himself for supporting genocide, because that’s my single issue. I disagree with Biden on so many things but this is the one thing I and many many other voters will not budge on.

                    I’d literally rather kill myself than vote for genocide. Just, go to a polling station and cast a 9mm ballot into the roof of my mouth.