- cross-posted to:
- latestagecapitalism@lemmygrad.ml
- cross-posted to:
- latestagecapitalism@lemmygrad.ml
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I think the best solution is a healthy balance of socialism and capitalism.
Extremes always tend to be dangerous.
“I think we need a balance between the system that wants to oppress workers to maximise profit, and the system which wants workers to control their own lives”
I think the best solution is a healthy balance of socialism and capitalism.
Why?
Extremes always tend to be dangerous.
WHY?
Too much socialism encourage laziness, incompetence and poverty.
Too much capitalism encourage inequity, exploitation and consumerism.
I think both socialism and capitalism have their own pros and cons. But both are necessary.
Too much socialism encourage laziness, incompetence and poverty.
Does it? Says who? The Chicago school of economics?
Too much capitalism encourage inequity, exploitation and consumerism.
All Capitalism.
What good does Capitalism do?
You sound like someone that never worked in his entire life.
I hope I’m wrong.
You’re very wrong, and failed to address any of my arguments or back your own claims up, it’s jusy vibes and mysticism.
I didn’t fail to address any argument.
If you actually worked at least once in your life, you would understand the value of working, making money, competency and being useful to society.
I think you’re coping because you’re useless and incompetent. You’re using socialism as an escape mechanism.
I have worked, and continue to work. I understand how my labor is exploited by the bourgeois class and I do not recieve the bulk of the Value I create. I suggest reading Wage Labor and Capital and Value, Price and Profit.
I am certainly not the most competent worker, but I am definitely more competent than the parasites exploiting me without lifting a finger.
You clearly have a misconception of what socialism is. Socialism does not mean sit around and collect benefits from the government. It means that workers (yes, people who WORK) own the means of production, rather than the do-nothing capitalist class which makes money parasitically from simply owning things.
I think the best solution is a healthy balance of kindergartens and child labour factories.
Extremes always tend to be dangerous.
I think we need a blend of false equivalencies and dangerous extremes.
I know you disagree with me, but your joke was so good I had to upvote
Who’s going to pay your kindergartens?
You mean market socialism
Don’t forget depression, anxiety and thought crime caused by social media addiction
Lemmy is made by actual communists, so let’s not pretend communism would somehow fix that.
Yea, these are the real communists, not like all those other communists, with their fake communism.
Well, if you ask any communist, they’ll tell you that real communism has never been tried, which implies that all other communists are fake.
All communist social-media addicts are always hsppy for the rest of their lives, of course! The addiction can’t be the issue, it has to be capitalism!
Hey, I became a lot more hopeful for the future after reading Marx. Capitalism does indeed suck, but it’s unsustainable.
The problem Marx didn’t foresee is that capitalism can sustain itself until it destroys us all. In Nazi Germany, this left the country a bombed out pile of rubble. In modern times, it’s global warming.
Marx definitely foresaw that possibility, his conclusions are more that if there aren’t grand wars or famines eliminating everyone, Capitalism itself cannot last forever, which is far more comforting than assuming socialism can vibe itself into existence.
I dont think the FED + state which printed 70% of USD money supplies during covid years has anything to do with capitalism and free market… They are anti free market and capitalism if anything…
rofl it’s not communism just because the government is involved…
The US is capitalist. Full stop. Period. The government BUYS its physical currency, for fuck’s sake.
You see only binary. I didnt said its communism, I said its not free market capitalism, if the state can devalue your money by half with a single action (why do you think basic groceries cost double since 2020 ?), and its not a free market capitalism, when they impose 50% tariffs on anything Chinese regarding EVs and stuff around https://apnews.com/article/biden-china-tariffs-electric-vehicles-solar-254546e92f823a78220c195a0a42a10e
They dont buy their currency, they print promissory notes, that they will repay the debt, in exchange for money. And if you still believe that US can once repay its debt, you are delusional… Especially now, as China and many others are trying to get rid of petro dolars…
bahaha You are the one with binary thinking… The government doesn’t magically mean “not capitalist”, fool. When the government spends money, it’s not magically “not capitalist”, either.
The US government is capitalist because they back up and enforce things for corporations’ bottom line. You speak of debt as if that magically makes them not capitalist… You are quite literally ignorant on what “capitalist” even means. Sad. Pathetically sad.
“Free market capitalism” is a fairytale we tell school children. Free market capitalism would be me filling up my car with leaded gasoline before going to work at a meth plant, but also I gotta pay the toll to use the private roads.
It’s simple, a State in Capitalist society serves the interests of the Bourgeoisie and defends Capitalism.
Capitalism naturally destroys free markets.
People miss that Adam Smith in his writing was arguing in favor of small enterprise and in favor of the government busting up monopolies
Fuckin’ A right.
in USA*
In most places under the American empire’s control to varying degrees.*
At least if you lived in a socialist place before that naturally left you so helpless that you now wish for the heavy restrictions to be back because you rely on them.
“At least the walls of the prison kept me warm”…
What?
Is anyone on Lemmy worried about socialism?
Who is this for?
The choir. This is preaching to the choir.
Well as long as we’ll have guns then things can be turned around…
You’re gonna need a nuke, big guy. You aren’t taking on the American military with your lil pea shooter.
It can be done with guns or it can be done without. Can is the magic word here, and guns are optional.
Lol, as if their Wal Mart rifles are going to help them against reaper drones.
The USA loses to people less armed than the USA all the time.
The US won all nearly all their engagements in Vietnam, Iraq, and Afghanistan. The difference was the lack of public support to keep those wars and occupations going.
You would think that the public wouldn’t support a war the US wages on the public.
The war on drugs has entered the chat
When half the people want it, it will.
This is it.
People keep insisting that the populace would win a war of populace against state… maybe it would, I don’t know and it’s not the problem.
The problem is a war of half the populace against the state and the other half of the populace. Fascism is carried into power by popular demand, it’s not like one day they just appear on the levers of power and have to put up with a revolting population. They will have been put there by the population, and it will be the better armed half of the population.
But it would be an easy war of attrition no? How many died/almost died because Texas couldn’t handle a lil iced? How long could those states last without resources from outside? How much of their materials are usable raw?
Do the “much guns” states actually have a decent bit of knowledgeable people? Being able to shoot a gun is fine and all but a war is far more than that.
The biggest worry would probably be the ones already in the military who could/would easily sabotage any efforts. And yes, drones are easily beating rifles when it comes to depleting each other’s resources.
I know fuck-all about guns and war but my armchair is warmed up.
That last bit is all conservatives care about keeping though.
They care about keeping the guns because they can’t see they are one stupidity away from the guns being used on them. All it will take is all those idiots believing something bad about their leadership. Something that may not even have a shred of truth. After all once a regressive starts thinking somethings true, no truth will every sway them from the lie.
The US has the largest government in the history of the world, it is not remotely pure capitalist.
It’s absolutely Capitalist and additonally Imperialist. Having a government doesn’t mean it isn’t Capitalist, especially if the bourgeoisie controls the state, rather than the proletariat.
Who do you think the US government works for?
Many of them work for the rich, some of them have integrity, but most are just in it for their own power and benefit.
Power and benefit, also sometimes referred to with the term “capital”
Not really, its more control of people. The ability to feel power over a domain.
Which is a form of capital. Our politicians use that power for monetary profit. That shits just intrinsic to building an entire system with capitalism at it’s heart like we been doing since the late 60s
You are shoehorning the word capitalism in there.
You could argue that, but are these personal benefits not just checks from lobbyists? And does this power not come largely from the leverage they gain expanding their influence in order to justify bigger checks?
I think we agree, and the only solution that I see as workable is to greatly reduce the power of the government on all levels.
Do you think the capitalists who say exactly that, have integrity? Could you name one?
The part about reducing government size?
Yes the part about reducing government size. You have project 2025 that wants to get rid of the EPA and the Department of Education. Do the billionaires support this project because they have integrity or because it’s good for their bottom line?
Som… the american dream.
So “Capitalism” ( by which you mean crony Corps in league with government - a socialist system) took away socialist ‘benefits’ - huh. Are you sure you are looking at the right end if the stick?
Jesse, what the fuck are you talking about?
Being ‘left’ is being pro 2A, fumbled it there at the end.
I’m seeing a lot more libs understanding what 2A is really for.
Citizens will not stop a coup attempt using guns. You’re watching too many movies. Be realistic.
Idk it seems like everytime a trained, well-equipped military goes up against a bunch of farmers the military loses so I’m not sure I agree with you.
Right, when was the last time that happened on us soil again?
Also, do you actually see Americans as some kind of guerilleros? With current obesity numbers, there’s no hiding in improvised shelters for most. Let alone simple but crucial things like “running”. Did you think of how the country isn’t totally unknown to the military, negating one of the major advantages for defenders in past such situations?
By all means, do not agree with me. You can’t convince me you actually believe us citizens have a fighting chance against the fucking us military, though. Absolutely delusional!
Students of history disagree. Remember when they told us we’d smash Vietnam in a month? Remember when they said the same thing about Iraq? You can come up with all the “but it’s different this time!” you like, I agree we probably won’t come to an agreement on this, have a nice day.
Why are you ignoring my questions? I don’t remember anybody saying “Iraqis are probably too fat and complacent for guerilla tactics”. “Students of history” won’t disagree that there’s a huge difference between the 1970s us army fighting guerilleros in Vietnam and the 21st century us army fighting a bunch of tacticool idiots on us soil.
Did you notice that your only argument is “nah, it wouldn’t be different” without any substantiation?
Why are you ignoring my questions?
I don’t owe you an argument. I’ve stated my position and you’ve stated yours. Have a nice Friday.
WDYM, it’s not like the structural problems of capitalism would favor fascists if we provide a market for buying guns. It’s not like fascists are the ones with more money and time from owning a business or something. I would totally show up to defend my country from a coup as long as it coincides with my work break. /s
And to top it all off, in order to preserve the only thing they have left - their freedom - they want to hand the country over to a dictator. It just doesn’t get any more oxymoronic than that.
Fascism is the logical endpoint of capitalism. Just look up the largest German companies, then what they did between 1933 and 1945.
No, fascism is communism.
Communism is on the left end of the political spectrum. Fascism is on the right end.
To be fair, communism as seen under Stalin and fascism aren’t too different, horseshoe theory. Pulling the definition of fascism from wikipedia: “a far-right, authoritarian, ultranationalist political ideology and movement, characterized by a dictatorial leader, centralized autocracy, militarism, forcible suppression of opposition, belief in a natural social hierarchy, subordination of individual interests for the perceived good of the nation or race, and strong regimentation of society and the economy.”
Dictatorial leader, centralized autocracy, militarism, forcible suppression of opposition, subordination of individual interests for the perceived good of the nation, strong regimentation of the economy, you could see all of those things while Stalin was in power and many continued on subsequent USSR leaders.
It’s no wonder George Orwell, a democratic socialist, saw the USSR and said “fuck no, I don’t want that shit”
Bolsheviks were the most extreme faction, and bred authoritarianism into their movement. Wilson fucked things up for us there. I don’t consider Lenin or Stalin to be communists. They are authoritarian dictators. That’s antithetical to communist ideologies. I understand that the perception may be skewed, but no one thinks that North Korea is a democratic republic, despite their name.
That’s a myth peddled by Americans.
Tell me you’ve never read communist theory, without telling me you’ve never read communist theory.
You realize that even The Christ was a communist? He literally told his followers to live in communes and share.
Lol ok. Brainwashing is hard in you.
Your projection would be hilarious if it wasn’t so embarrassing
Most brain dead take on this thread so far lmao
There is an amazing video by a Youtuber called Fredda about Coca Cola in Nazi Germany which goes over how the company worked during that time period and afterwards.
Great video.
Last Week Tonight did an overview of Fanta being Nazi Coca-Cola. Pretty sure that was their first season too.
Shareholders Uber Alles
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