Apple forced to ditch iPhone lightning charger::Apple confirms new iPhone 15 will have a common USB-C charging port after EU forces it into the change.
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Regulations work. Suck it, predatory businesses. Literally, eat shit.
I’m pretty convinced their plan was to release a USB-C iPhone this year either way.
Their product roadmaps extend far out into the future; these products require a lot of lead time to develop and integrate. They had until the end of 2024 to comply, which means one more release. They started their journey to USB-C several years ago, so it’s not like it wasn’t part of the plan, and they had no reason to hurry up and force it out this year, risking integration issues.
The EU is going to take the credit, but I think the chance for a coincidence here is strong.
They first started using USB c on the macbooks in 2015. There’s no way that it took 8 years to get it ready for the iPhone. In that time they’ve also released several other devices and accessories which have used lightning.
To me this doesn’t point to a planned gradual shift over to USB c but one that was forced by neccesity on the macbook then by regulation on the iPhone.
The narrative around Lightning was always that they’d keep it for 10 years and then move to something new, Schiller even called it “a modern connector for the next decade” when it was announced, and at the time it was better than anything else on the market.
No one who’s been paying attention is surprised that Apple switched this year and not next. I’d love to go dig up my years old comments on Reddit about this but like many of us I deleted my whole history. I had hoped they’d advance the timeline and release the 14 with USBC because of the EU regs, but I’m convinced this was the plan because they waited for the lighting to fulfill its 10 year target (just like with the 30 pin connector) and not until the EU regs actually forced them in 2024.
When the iPad switched to USBC in 2018 it was a foregone conclusion that iPhone would too, and the assumption was always for it to happen in 2023.
How does it take 5 years to integrate the world’s most popular and standardised connector?
Call me a cynic, but maybe they just wanted another five years of selling over priced cables and another five years of controlling another part of the “ecosystem”.
I’m saying it was a choice to ride out the full 10 years with lightning, not a limitation. They tooled up for 10 years of lightning and they stuck to the plan.
Apple produces hardware at a scale not imaginable to mortal people. When they want to use a chip in their phone, they just buy up the chip’s factory’s entire production run for the next few years.
Apple was the only company that had no shortages during the chip troubles of 2020/21/22. That’s because they plan ahead. They have a logistics person at the helm, and it’s very visible.
All of this naturally leads to ridiculous planning cycles.
How does it taste?
Starfuckers, Inc
Why would the 2015 MacBook’s USB-C ports been forced by necessity?
Also remember the outrage when Apple moved form the 30-pin connector to Lightning. People were very upset and Apple promised they wouldn’t be switching ports all the time and it was made to serve them for a really long time… as every accessory with a lightning port just became e-waste. I guess Mother Nature didn’t see that.
as every accessory with a lightning port just became e-waste. I guess Mother Nature didn’t see that.
I think it’s interesting that you see this as USB-C’s fault.
If Apple had stuck to a standard connector they would have been on usb-c in a year or two anyway and none of that e-waste would exist.
Or if they went back on their word and switched to usb-c from lightning after a couple years, there would also be way less Lightning e-waste. What do you think happens to all those Lightning accessories when someone switches from iPhone to a different device?
Apple’s proprietary Lightning connector is responsible for the e-waste, not USB-C or regulators.
These regulations will stop companies like Apple making proprietary connectors purely for profit that generate all the e-waste in the first place.
Lol, a cable is barely e waste. The power Adapter is where the e waste is, and those usb A blocks can easily still be used, even if you only have usb-C cables lying around. For very little money, you can buy an Adapter from usb-A to C and you can still use them. I don’t get the eWaste argument on copper cables…
There were no good standards when Lightning was released. There were several different USB options… mini, micro, etc, all of which only worked one way and sucked to use. If I remember correctly there was also something related to audio that USB at the time wasn’t good at, which lightning could handle. Hence the removal of the headphone jack.
USB-C was finalized 2 years later so the decade of Lighting e-waste is still on Apple for holding out as long as they did.
Maybe instead of designing a whole new Lightning connector they should have been pioneers and been one of the first to make a USB-C phone.
No one wants a new connector every 2 years. When Lightning was announced the 30-pin connector was in service for almost a decade and they said Lightning was designed for the next decade. So now it’s been a decade and they changed again. I guess we’ll see another new connector sometime around 2033, if USB can keep itself together long enough. It’s fragmentation is a bit of a joke.
“Hence the removal of the headphone jack.”
What does that have to do with USB vs Lightning? Besides, Lightning to Headphone Jack adapters as well as lightning airpods use a DAC inside the cable.
Boy, some of you are really drinking the Apple koolaid.
As far as I know the fastest charging over lightning even now is 20 Watts which is far too slow for a laptop with a large battery. I suspect that they couldn’t use lightning on the macbooks for that reason.
If their intention was to limit waste then they wouldn’t have continued to produce lightning accessories if the plan was to transition in just a few years
Laptops were never charged with lightning and it makes zero sense that they ever would. It was never necessary and they received a LOT of hate over using USB-C on the laptops because they were extremely early to the party. The exact same hate was heaped on them when they implemented USB before everyone else.
You apparently don’t remember (or care) about how they faced a lot of backlash when they moved from the 30-pin to Lightning on iPhone. They promised accessory manufacturers that they wouldn’t change the iPhone port again for at least 10 years, and we are right at that mark. Other products have been transitioning to USB-C in a somewhat logical order. All of the products that charge with lightning now are iPhone accessories and there is little reason to have different charge ports on products that are meant to be used together.
The only argument that isn’t just pure ignorance seems to boil down to “Apple evil”
Lightning was never on the MacBooks, so that’s not a reason for the MacBooks to move to USB-C. Prior to USB-C MacBooks used MagSafe to charge, which is what the new ones are back to using.
Give over. They were passive aggressive as fuck in their statements after the EU mandated it.
I would’ve been too. The EU flexes too hard on some of this stuff. It was obviously on Apple’s roadmap.
I guess if a new/better connector comes along we have to wait for the EU to give everyone permission to move the technology forward? How does this even work going forward?
I like the idea of 1 port for everything, but a regional government effectively mandating what the whole world must use is fucked.
I guess if a new/better connector comes along we have to wait for the EU to give everyone permission to move the technology forward?
The EU is mandating open standards, not specific open standards.
If a new and better connector comes around they are welcome/encouraged to use it. As long as it’s an open standard and not proprietary e-waste generating junk
I don’t know any reason why switching to USB-C would’ve been on Apple’s roadmap. Controlling the lighting ecosystem is far too valuable for them. Apple’s refusal to switch to the common USB-C is one of the reasons this law exists in it’s current form.
Theyre not stupid if you read it before writing about it on Lemmy you’d see they’re required to review regularly with stakeholders to agree and amend requirements ‘in line with scientific and technological progress, consumer convenience and environmental developments’
Oh good, bureaucracy… that always produces great results.
You’re trying too hard.
Apple would have implemented USB-C ages ago if they had any intention of ever doing it willingly.
Everything they make uses USB-C except the iphone which uses lightning and funnily enough they get a substantial cut out of every accessory and cable sale.
The EU has a FAQ somewhere addressing this, can’t find it though.
And calling the EU a regional government is underplaying their power and international influence a LOT.
The iPad used to use Lightning, why did they move that over if it’s all about getting a cut of accessory sales?
We saw with the iPad that they took their time, starting with the high end of the market with the Pro and eventually releasing it to all. It took several years.
The iPhone being their biggest volume product, it made sense to do it last. Let people get other USB-C stuff in their house before the iPhone moves so fewer people complain about having to buy all new chargers.
Is the EU not a government over some, but not all of Europe, a region of the larger Eurasia continent? What else would I call them?
Eh, I don’t know Apple’s intentions but this specific design change isn’t that complicated. The lightning port still uses the USB protocol so the firmware will be the same or very similar. The supporting electronics also wouldn’t change much, but at most they’d omit/add a few small passives and slightly reroute that part of the circuit to make things fit together. They’d also have to lock down a large production run of USB ports, but any manufacturer would accommodate a customer as large as Apple. They’d need to test fit it with the new phone chassis but that’s relatively simple as well. Regulatory certification would also be smooth sailing for a change this simple, since most of what’s changing is simply the form factor.
I figure it would take two years before customers would see this design change from the moment engineering was assigned it.
I’m an electrical engineer who works in production if that matters.
I can corroborate this. They weren’t unprepared, but this wasn’t late warning.
Law was approved in 2022.
You say it would take about 2 years and the EU gave companies 24 months, which is all in line…. But it’s only been about 12 months since the directive was approved. Do you think Apple could pivot to get it done in a year if they weren’t already planning it, especially when there was no legal reason to rush it?
I doubt Apple just learned of the pending EU rule 12 months ago as it was passed.
The alternative is to take a gamble that it won’t be approved and then be stuck with phones that weren’t in compliance (ignoring the 24 month grace period) and having the development clock start immediately for future models. I’m sure they saw which way the winds were blowing, knew they had no populist counter argument opposing the change, and decided it was in their best interest to join literally every other manufacturer on the planet in using a standard port.
It’s really hard to say without being personally involved. Two years is a very comfortable amount of time to implement that specific change. The biggest hurdle is passing regulatory testing early enough to begin manufacturing in time to build a large enough stockpile before release. If they really pushed it and threw enough people at it, manufacturing could begin as little as 6 months after starting. But that’s a very risky timeline because about a million things will still go wrong all throughout the process, and “simple” design changes like this are never, ever simple.
I’m impressed if they began production one year after deciding to make the change. The EU directive might’ve been approved roughly a year ago, but Apple might’ve seen writing on the wall and started earlier too. Regardless of context, this is definitely not a >2-3 year process though.
I wasn’t saying they’d take 3 years, but that they would at least use the 2 years to avoid the risk of a rush job. The iPhone is their most important product and I don’t see them putting it at risk to rush something out when there was no requirement to rush.
Maybe they started early, or worked on both in parallel, if they saw the writing on the wall and wanted a hedge. But typically, or maybe I should say historically, Apple hasn’t been one to do something just because someone tells them to, and if forced they would maintain their own vision as long as possible until they had to make the change. I remember years ago reading that they paid a daily fine in their stores for not displaying ‘no smoking’ signs, because they didn’t like how they looked. I want to say this was in England, but it was a long time ago and I couldn’t quickly find an article on it.
Could they?
Yeah probably. USB-C connectors are ubiquitous, I’m certain they could acquire the necessary components in short notice if they had to. From my understanding they essentially did just swap the connector and kept the same USB2.0 controller.
Did they?
I doubt it, they had plenty of notice this was coming and were likely already preparing for it.
I wouldn’t be surprised if the second USB-C iPhone release gets a modern controller with USB 3.2 or even 4, and Apple talks it up like they have single-handedly made USB-C fast all by theirselves (and imply that other mobile devices haven’t had the same for far longer)
Only the standard iPhone is running at USB2 speeds. The Pro has a faster controller.
If they were going to do a roll out like the iPads, the Pro would have gotten USB-C first, then the normal iPhone would get it next year. Maybe that’s why the Pro has the better and more modern controller… they were planning on doing that first, but with the EU thing, maybe they just decided to get it all out of the way instead of the phased roll out like they did with iPad.
Why are you getting downvoted 🤔 I’m pretty sure apple would have kept lighting on the “cheap” phones until the complete removal of any port (I assume they kill the port on the “cheap” phone in the next 5 years) and give the pro thunderbolt like they did this year. I’m thinking this, because I bet not even 1% of “cheap” iPhone users uses the port for data transfer (keep in mind that 1% of “cheap” iPhone users are still plenty talking in absolute numbers)
Just because Apple forced their users to switch everything to wireless, doesn’t mean cables are obsolete.
More users would use cable if it was actually decently implemented, like with many Android manufacturers.
Because cable has many advantages over wireless, like having transfer speeds more than 10 times faster.
You know how many fucking lawyers they have? They were well-prepared.
What does that have to do with anything?
You’re right, lawyers have nothing to do with laws.
What are you talking about? I said they didn’t legally need to move to USB-C until the end of 2024. A team of lawyers isn’t required to figure that out. I have no idea what point you’re trying to make.
This law is more than a decade in the making, the only reason it was on Apples roadmap is because of this law.
The EU doesn’t have to mandate a new connector when something new comes up, it just has to be an open standard, ANY open standard. This is miles better for everyone. And the EU doesn’t force the whole world to adapt their standard, it’s just not economical to produce different versions for different markets, but they are very much allowed to sell whatever to their non EU customers.
If you really want the lightning adapter back, you can ask one of the many people who soldered a usb-c connector in an iphone 12/13/14. If one person can do it, I’m pretty sure Apple can, too.
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Oh man you have not followed all of this progress have you? the EU has been pushing for this for a long time now, if this was their planall along Apple could have stated that they planned to do this in the future but that they were waiting for closure of their original connector, but they didn’t, all their communications until this decission was made have been that lightning was not going away. Suddenly, it was their plan all along. It’s… so much like apple to do this and so in line for their fans to eat it up.
They aren’t exactly known for sharing their plans publicly. They do stuff like that all the time to avoid leaking plans of their internal roadmap.
itr’s not about sharing their plans publicly, it’s about their intent being 180 of what they say now. When this was being worked on in the EU, Apple was pretty clearly against it. If their plan was to do it anyway them opposing the forced change would make no sense.
Are people astroturfing here? Seriously? It may be one of the worst place for that, and it looks like a very bad troll.
Huh?
If they were going to switch anyway, they wouldn’t have struggled until the EU had to make regulations around it.
Regulations means the market can’t regulate itself. The market in this case being Apple.
What struggle?
I’m sure the push for non proprietary standards before the latest EU rules had some part to play as well
They had until the beginning of 2024, that is by 2024 USB C had to be the standard, leaving Apple no choice with Iphones introduced in 2023’s fall.
EU sets December 28th, 2024, deadline for all new phones to use USB-C for wired charging
USB-type C to become EU’s common charger by end of 2024
Either they changed the date or you’re wrong on this.
You’re right. I stand corrected.
I think they wanted to go to usb-c (as that’s what all their other products use) but they didn’t want to face the backlash from customers when “all their cables and docks had to be changed again”. Luckily for apple the EU gave them a fall guy.
If that was the case apple wouldn’t talk so openly about how that’s bad for the consumer. They want to keep Lightning since they want to control the iPhone accessory ecosystem.
Of course they would, “I’m sorry that all your accessories no longer work guys, it was all the EU’s fault”.
It probably depends on the consumer. Most (older) people I know are always irritated which cable they actually need, so it’s great to just be able to give them one with USB C.
Edit: They often have other devices with USB C anyway (e.g. headphones).
Everyday just makes me love the EU more and more.
😏next will be replaceable batteries, alternative App Stores and messengers who have to use a open protocol for chat (open in a sense that different chat apps can Talk to each other, but the privacy is still protected. Like eMail but with end to end encryption)
The word you’re looking for is “federated”.
It’s not, really. They’re not being forced to interoperate or adopt a standard intermediary protocol, just to publish APIs. WhatsApp and iMessage will still be totally separate services if they want to be.
Interoperability is also a word you can use Crosscompatible Lots of cromulent words.
And a hefty backdoor for the government to put it’s dirty little naily fingers in
I hope that the protocol is open source and approved by trusted privacy protection peoples everywhere in the world. But yea, better everyone would have their own matrix servers, I agree.
Which government? There isn’t just one in the EU.
Or are you talking about the US government?
I live in the EU so yes I know
I was talking about an abstract entity government not any government in particular
The EU is quite awesome, eh? They are so nice! (/s)
For real, babe.
Thank fuck, the lightning charger is hot dogshit, IMO. Th lack of compatibility of iphone is annoying, particularly around how 3rd party charging cords won’t work with their products sometimes.
I had an iphone for over a decade, and finally switched to android. It suits me better. I spend a lot less time thinking ‘i should be able to do this’ and looking for a workaround
Only good thing about Lightning was the connector itself, but USB-C is a much needed improvement. The speed thing though, that gets me, especially when non-flagship devices aren’t limited to 2.x speeds.
Charger compatibility is a big thing. Back in the ancient days, sales men used to tell me to buy a Nokia phone because everyone had a Nokia charger at home. If you bought an Ericsson or Siemens, nobody could help you if you ran out of battery.
Well that didn’t last forever, since Nokia eventually decided to switch to a slim connection, but before that the compatibility was really good.
Yeah the lightning charger in my experience immediately breaks when I put it in any position it just doesn’t like.
Edit: should clarify I use an Android now
You’ll feel right at home with usb-c then. I use both every day and, honestly, they both suck.
But with Usb-c you get Power Delivery which kicks the shit out of old 5v 2a nonsense
I find usb-c generally better. faster charging, as you’ve pointed out. I find the connections usually a lot more secure too. I have one cord in my car for android auto that’s a finicky little bitch, though, and I’m about to yeet that thing, if I ever remember to replace it. All of my other cords have held up well, and it’s really nice to have the ability to charge all of my devices with one cord.
Just curious why you think USB C sucks? I think it’s gotten to a mature point now with PD 3.0 or 3.1. I have 1 cable next to my bed that will charge my phone, headphones, laptop, tablet etc. No worrying at all.
Part of the issue is exactly what you just mentioned: There are a lot of different standards with varying degrees of compatibility, and none of them are visibly different from one another. There isn’t a good way to immediately identify which cables are “good” and which will just outright refuse to charge your devices. So some of my USB-C cables will charge low power devices, but not bigger things like a laptop or iPad.
Meanwhile, the lightning charger was really really good at enforcing uniformity across different cables. Because you knew you could plug any lighting cable into any lightning port, and it would charge just fine. Yes, this inevitably caused issues with speed as tech progressed and Apple refused to upgrade to new standards. But that refusal also helped them maintain uniformity. Apple also shifted away from hardline data transfers years ago; 99.9% of iPhone users will have iCloud backups happen automatically via wifi, and iCloud means you’re not doing full phone backups every time. You only do the initial backup, then it simply pushes daily changes as you go whenever you connect to wifi. So the actual amount of data that gets transferred is relatively low with day-to-day usage, and it doesn’t eat into your limited call phone data plan. The regular user rarely (if ever) needs to transfer anything via the lightning port, because wireless sync takes care of things as long as they’re on wifi.
The rapid development of USB-C has been great for the tech. But it also means that (as someone who has an iPhone and has very little need for USB-C cables) I’ve bought more USB-C cables in the past two or three years than I have lightning cables. Because my five year old lightning cables are still working fine, while all of my USB-C cables from before the pandemic had to be replaced; Not because they were broken, but simply because newer devices would refuse to charge with them.
Yeah I get that there are some teething issues but for an iphone geezer now it should be pretty ubiquitous. USB C to USB C cables will do 60w. Then if they have the special chip they can do 100W + (5A).
It’s even less of an issue for an iphone 15 that will likely top out at 25w.
A gorilla wrote this post
You can charge faster than 10W using Lightning to USB-C
I’ve only ever had one lightning charger break. Been using iPhones for a decade.
…I do electrical tape and heat shrink the ends, though. So they probably helps a little.
Three cheers for the EU! 🇪🇺
Good job EU, screw you Apple
deleted by creator
Are you sure it’s firmware or software limited?
I assumed they just kept the lightning controller, which as you said had USB 2.0 speeds, and then hardwired a USB-C adapter into the phone/circuit board. So it’s a hardware limit.
The non-pro iphone 15 uses a different processor (A16 vs A17) which doesn’t have the controller for 10gbps speeds. Its the processor from the iphone 14 pro.
That’s disgusting. Knowing for some that would be a dealbreaker to upgrade to the pro.
And thus they get extra money for the sale of the more expensive one. That’s the plan for why the cheaper model exists anyway
Honestly I can’t imagine anyone that would care enough about hardwire transfer speeds more than raw performance. Imo, anyone that cares about those raw transfer speeds will already want the A17 Pro and wouldn’t settle for the A16 Bionic.
The 15 uses an older chip that was designed for iPhones with lighting cables limited to USB 2. So it’s unlikely the hardware is there for USB 3/4 speeds. But it’s not unfeasible to add a dedicated chip for faster USB speeds.
Where as the pro model uses a new chipset. Designed for the 15 pro and likely the 16 non-pro. This has on due USB 3. It would be short sighted to not include it here.
Both phones would have very fast WiFi, I imagine that’s the use case for 90%+ of users.
Nah, let Apple cripple their own products out of spite…
I find it odd that this is the only noteworthy feature in the new phone.
pretty much all smartphones past few years have been incremental upgrades. Sometimes theres some gimmick but it really feels like we’ve reached a peak
The Fold/Flip were pretty big jumps in tech.
Idk why you’re being downvoted, its true. Folding screen technology has been pretty much the only major innovation in the phone space for a while now.
Folding is high on the “neato” scale but isn’t considered a major milestone because it’s really sort of a gimmick and in smartphone terms, is a small niche feature. Most people don’t want a thicker phone that can become a too-small tablet by slowly forming a damage crease down its screen.
I remember when people thought a front facing camera was niche.
and it was 5 years ago at least.
NOOOOOOO! This goes against their narrative that they chose to do it! How dare you!
The only thing Apple chose themselves was placing an artificial limit on the port.
No one will ever miss you
This is the best summary I could come up with:
Apple has confirmed its new iPhone will not feature its proprietary lightning charging port, after the EU forced it into the change.
The tech giant said that the iPhone 15, unveiled at its annual event on Wednesday, would use a USB-C cable as the “universally accepted standard”.
The EU had told the tech giant to ditch its proprietary charging ports to make life easier for consumers, save them money, and help reduce e-waste by encouraging re-use of chargers.
But some experts questioned whether consumers would be prepared to pay the high price tags given the devices are not hugely different to their predecessors.
“Convincing users to fork out for these new devices will not be easy during a cost-of-living crisis,” said Paolo Pescatore, analyst and founder of PP Foresight.
“Some will see the new features as incremental, [although] collectively they enhance the overall experience which is priceless among Apple’s core user base.”
The original article contains 457 words, the summary contains 152 words. Saved 67%. I’m a bot and I’m open source!
Good bot
Now, I’m waiting how they will use marketing and communication on ditching the magsafe and going back to only USB-C.
Magsafe it’s pretty cool tho. Plus they open sourced it so next Qi standard is probably gonna have it. I don’t know what I’m talking about btw.
We are not speaking about the same magsafe. EU requires in the near future USB-C for laptops too. Apple must include USB-C by default and ditching the magsafe.
Are they going to ditch it though? As I understand, they don’t need to ditch it as long as USB-C remains an option.
For charging alone, Magsafe is objectively the better choice because it snaps in and out of place, so it’s both easier to insert and won’t pull your laptop off the living room table if your kid or dog runs into the cable. For docking in your dedicated workspace, you’ll still use USB-C attached to your monitor of course, it’s excellent for that.
Yeah, I think it says that you have to support USB-C charging. But you can add whatever else you want. And if I remember correctly, macbooks can be charged via C and magsafe already. So all up to snuff
Yup, both work!
The regulation is the same as for smartphones. In the EU, laptops must charge with USB-C by default. Apple can still include on the laptop a magsafe port which will be useless for the consumer in this area. The easiest to comply for Apple is to put a USB-C to USB-C cable instead of the USB-C to magsafe for Europe.
My laptop can already charge over USB-C from my docking station, or with a MagSafe cable. It’s an older M1 laptop but that ought to cover any such requirement
It’s the single charger regulation. In the EU, Apple must use USB-C instead of magsafe for the laptops. It’s the same as for smartphones.
In apple’s defense, lightning pre-dates USB-C by a few years. There are a ton of lightning accessories in the wild that have been made useless e-waste by this forced change. I’m glad we’re all on an agreed-upon standard, though. It had to happen at some point.
They knew USB C was coming, they still didn’t give a fuck.
They were the first/earliest to release a consumer a consumer device with USB C. They were also part of the consortium that developed USB C.
I think they were scared of the backlash they got the first time they switched from the iPod connector the lighting cable. This made them promise not to change the connector for 10 years.
If they changed earlier they would have broken their promise.
Apple should have had the foresight to see USB C was on the way. It was released two years after lighting.
It’s possible apple was convinced the connector should work either way unlike USB micro. But the USB consortium preferred a simpler design that was not reversible. Releasing the lighting connector forced the USB consortium to accept a reversible connector.
Before lightning and USB-C every manufacturer had their own connector. Then the EU told the manufacturers toneither come up with a common connector or they would regulate. Then, Apple started with lighting and other manufacturers joined under micro USB B. The EU was still not happy because Apple went their own way and, after USB C came out and was good (micro USB was quite bad TBF) they forced everyone to use USB C
It’s cold in here.
Has hell frozen over?!?
As long as it still refuses to charge because of fluff in the port - take my money!
Wireless charging is a thing, but I’d say it’s less practical than just cleaning your port out every now and again.
Apple lightning cable it means. The charger still works fine
